WEBVTT

d22ca86d-8d08-4463-8d00-166ab1d291c2-0
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The following is a special presentation
of the Not Quite Right Podcast,

d22ca86d-8d08-4463-8d00-166ab1d291c2-1
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in which we discuss in detail entries to
our ****** flash fiction competition,

d22ca86d-8d08-4463-8d00-166ab1d291c2-2
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the Not Quite Right Prize for Flesh
Fiction.

028662d6-d857-41c4-9431-e81f2bda8ae9-0
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This episode contains adult themes and is
not appropriate for listeners under the

028662d6-d857-41c4-9431-e81f2bda8ae9-1
00:00:16.060 --> 00:00:16.600
age of 18.

e6bde3fa-bf89-4582-b6d9-355f0d0066f1-0
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And mum, if you're still listening,
that's on you.

81ab05c1-5623-41c2-8579-9cdf280f9b2c-0
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Something doesn't seem quite right.

0c7b7956-250f-48e6-ae59-ae188995c58e-0
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Hi.

729ce4c4-3256-427d-bade-f7176d13f8be-0
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Hi.

11293278-2e47-4f2f-98bb-d97b8ba26c89-0
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My name's Ed and I'm Amanda.

f67ed35e-b862-4fb9-b305-7a15b15c6c41-0
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Oh.

da7ad5f3-afe9-4fc4-ae7a-7f4f50fed958-0
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Did you think it was over?

035469f7-bf96-47f0-a688-9c5ad8db3118-0
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Did you think flesh fiction was over?

2600d92b-ec9c-4a34-b8a3-cdeacde0b308-0
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Well, not quite.

9f9b0ae2-239f-4454-b7aa-5b552e97c0b1-0
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Because it's time for our bare devils.

1d7004bc-74ac-498b-9308-2fcd391f4d23-0
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And listen,
we're not going to go easy on them.

4bf9cf83-52e1-4f85-b1a8-e95b27dc171b-0
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We're going to ride them rough and raw
and painfully.

7e686f34-8865-4450-8f7d-708c9249a1f4-0
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Listen once again.

2b1afcad-8a38-45da-a7d9-b801bdf1f472-0
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I've never been more turned off in my
life.

eef380d2-d56b-4b0d-a073-5b14647e9b2c-0
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So listeners of the podcast will be very
familiar with our Daredevil episodes.

81b77faf-7ce3-4177-8c49-2009e1dbbffc-0
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And when we talk about daredevils,
we normally like to say that they have

81b77faf-7ce3-4177-8c49-2009e1dbbffc-1
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the honour and the privilege of having
their story eviscerated, ribbed to shreds,

81b77faf-7ce3-4177-8c49-2009e1dbbffc-2
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annihilated, decimated.

6b1e612c-50b6-484c-a75a-0627328ebe5f-0
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But our baredevils are going to be
perhaps penetrated.

c7f2da9a-266e-43e4-8acc-991b3242ceb7-0
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So we'll be reading some very sexy
stories.

746b00ed-bb89-4e52-b9eb-f92f1845df62-0
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We'll be talking about the stories,
breaking them down, sharing our thoughts.

0226f1e3-c3bf-479c-9446-78f583fbbe89-0
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Hopefully we'll all learn something in
the process.

6f58580c-c4d0-4f03-a9e9-efda1742dfd0-0
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If not, we'll at least have a bit of fun.

ff15229c-28fa-462a-bdfb-9fd69d18e5ad-0
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I know I will.

de93b934-a750-4b70-8200-43a955754812-0
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So, a willing victim for this round?

9ca42e14-1586-474c-b1c3-1502639b0c76-0
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I don't know.

136f2ce1-c7e7-4996-ba4f-89bd772e4a08-0
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Is it a victim?

feaf43a9-7e3e-449b-ab72-01905e626134-0
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I think we're the victims.

0a1bd723-e047-4bbc-9c68-a6614b36024d-0
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I feel like the victim a little.

536c6b31-8eea-4953-bebc-e84131148817-0
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You know,
as excited as I am to share this story

536c6b31-8eea-4953-bebc-e84131148817-1
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with everyone because I do think it is
wonderful,

536c6b31-8eea-4953-bebc-e84131148817-2
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I'm also a little bit nervous about
reading it a little bit out of practise.

6acc419f-8e96-428d-939f-95a2fd67611d-0
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It's been a while.

42cf8631-8ad3-4571-9db8-99854debbef5-0
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It has our Bare Devil.

274f3fb5-6647-4998-83fd-e082576df2fb-0
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Our very first Bare Devil is Jenny E and
it's Denny's first piece of ******

274f3fb5-6647-4998-83fd-e082576df2fb-1
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fiction, we've been told,
and that would be the case for a lot of

274f3fb5-6647-4998-83fd-e082576df2fb-2
00:02:05.195 --> 00:02:05.839
our entrance.

0f541cb4-3a38-4317-9b7c-75dc5a3fb8bb-0
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I feel this is their first time venturing
outside their comfort zone to write

0f541cb4-3a38-4317-9b7c-75dc5a3fb8bb-1
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something saucy.

5c11954b-e469-4cf0-a496-31c66995d55a-0
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This story features in the kink and taboo
category,

5c11954b-e469-4cf0-a496-31c66995d55a-1
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which was one of the smaller categories,
right?

7c464781-a09a-4256-af54-df91a1e6eee7-0
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So there were only a few places really in
the long list.

1679ae98-3edf-4c31-98d4-d45cdf38bb8f-0
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So it was very hard fought and
unfortunately,

1679ae98-3edf-4c31-98d4-d45cdf38bb8f-1
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this one didn't make the cut,
but it came very close, very, very close.

a32cd0f1-4ef6-4acb-9aa6-12abc6200895-0
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So I think without further ado,
let's read the damn story.

39374479-b67c-4052-9cfc-2998d79728e5-0
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Let's be uncomfortable for a little while,
OK?

9b614628-c068-4b13-bfac-fcc96fbdfa50-0
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And then we'll come back and talk about
it.

b650d5b8-7403-42de-a4f5-a710e99539d6-0
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And the story is voyeurism and
exhibitionism.

8ea5080a-ffbf-4e23-ba26-4b7bcffbe2e5-0
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HOA approved by Jenny E.

d6b9a998-507e-4ad6-ace1-fe200ba31647-0
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Unmistakable moans and the rhythmic
splashing of water on skin fills the air

d6b9a998-507e-4ad6-ace1-fe200ba31647-1
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from my second floor balcony.

28c0799e-7fe1-4f58-8762-f99e96d0fd83-0
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I lean into the darkness,
eyes scanning neighbouring backyards,

28c0799e-7fe1-4f58-8762-f99e96d0fd83-1
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searching for the source of pleasure,
spilling shamelessly into the night.

9776a951-f03b-4bd1-9e90-44bf2ccc3a0c-0
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I'm not proud of my regular voyeurism,
but I'm not embarrassed either.

869b3cf1-26d4-4b20-b5d5-f99146d0a863-0
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Shame requires the energy of caring,
and I'm too tired for that most days.

e648ded7-0e4e-4f1b-bbb2-e8610042c41e-0
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Too tired of being the tragic,
too fragile to **** neighbour widowed at

e648ded7-0e4e-4f1b-bbb2-e8610042c41e-1
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39 years old.

7891df0b-8f51-4116-8028-a180860e5d71-0
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Here in seaside backyards are more of a
suggestion than a sanctuary.

686261dc-1ab5-4529-ab93-79ca50fcb99e-0
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Small patches of grass are typically only
occupied by mud filled outdoor showers,

686261dc-1ab5-4529-ab93-79ca50fcb99e-1
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built less for modesty and more for the
design not to trek sand into luxury beach

686261dc-1ab5-4529-ab93-79ca50fcb99e-2
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homes during the day.

39f38def-ac0a-4415-bed5-3a2b1f5667e0-0
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The showers serve their intended purpose,
but this summer,

39f38def-ac0a-4415-bed5-3a2b1f5667e0-1
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without any obvious coordination,
just after midnight,

39f38def-ac0a-4415-bed5-3a2b1f5667e0-2
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all visible from my back porch,
a not so secret community of

39f38def-ac0a-4415-bed5-3a2b1f5667e0-3
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exhibitionists uses their showers for a
very different purpose,

39f38def-ac0a-4415-bed5-3a2b1f5667e0-4
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each one hoping neighbours are watching
and wanting.

44123ae4-d946-4a63-b68a-f80fe2ffafe9-0
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Tonight's groaning is closer than usual
and the scent of lavender soap permeates

44123ae4-d946-4a63-b68a-f80fe2ffafe9-1
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the air.

e49bb9c7-c5e0-4a80-bdc7-3e4058d38282-0
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It's been 4 weeks since the for sale sign
vanished and the lights flickered on next

e49bb9c7-c5e0-4a80-bdc7-3e4058d38282-1
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door.

d86284a9-ce17-4aa4-852d-58fde8788125-0
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Now, for the first time, there's movement.

49318e6f-aad0-408c-99e5-646af8fd7dcd-0
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Steam rises from the outdoor shower,
unveiling a solo body.

05599899-afee-4aea-891d-4da85519ddcd-0
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His back is to me,
one arm braced against the cedar wall as

05599899-afee-4aea-891d-4da85519ddcd-1
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his other strokes up and down.

7619bba6-f8b3-430b-9a1c-887e352817a7-0
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Well, hello new neighbour.

a2e04103-6f3a-414b-b9fa-b46cbed710cd-0
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The ocean breeze parts my white silk robe,
exposing my unkempt pubic hair that

a2e04103-6f3a-414b-b9fa-b46cbed710cd-1
00:05:10.083 --> 00:05:15.120
hasn't seen a man up close since Jacob's
boating accident 3 years ago.

dc34a7bc-ef52-459b-8eac-a97e665c735d-0
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I sink into a wide cushioned patio love
seat,

dc34a7bc-ef52-459b-8eac-a97e665c735d-1
00:05:20.743 --> 00:05:24.640
hungry for whatever tonight dares to
reveal.

530bdf75-80ec-43b0-bc64-4a6698446bf9-0
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Dancing string lights from the yellow
house 2 doors down catch my eye.

37ee6dec-4f29-4a9d-a805-32f191f367fd-0
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A man presses a woman against the shower
wall and kisses her with desperate

37ee6dec-4f29-4a9d-a805-32f191f367fd-1
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tenderness.

7cd67645-e7f8-4d5a-8148-c2b6b6410764-0
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My knees tremble watching them,
remembering the feeling of skin on skin,

7cd67645-e7f8-4d5a-8148-c2b6b6410764-1
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of love.

af253144-0b82-4797-a240-4b85cab07475-0
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He lifts her and she instinctively wraps
her legs around him.

b8d184b3-ed19-4c80-a3ff-3bf0fd6bd2b2-0
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A few pelvic presses later,
he loses his grip.

a5c688c9-9481-41e9-b49c-3e6b633a0775-0
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They laugh.

61a6fb3b-f92b-48b2-8242-bac75931c979-0
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It's real, intimate, messy and alive.

ba8cddbf-ddf8-4dd7-9993-1b2c3b125f20-0
00:06:07.480 --> 00:06:08.280
I miss that.

6fe6bcc5-84f8-48c5-925c-2908c217899e-0
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A steady patter of water comes from the
brick house behind me.

f9caa257-29eb-4ebb-a77d-eca070f0476a-0
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A new woman,
a younger version of his wife with

f9caa257-29eb-4ebb-a77d-eca070f0476a-1
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balloon like **** arches her back against
the shower wall.

74c2a6d0-16cd-4037-9fd9-190141bdb24b-0
00:06:27.240 --> 00:06:32.174
The man kneeling in front of her with his
face buried between her legs rocks his

74c2a6d0-16cd-4037-9fd9-190141bdb24b-1
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head in tune with her moans.

fe4cd50a-da80-418e-bb46-fcf911811f56-0
00:06:35.400 --> 00:06:40.876
She sees me watching,
holds my gaze and raises the pitch of her

fe4cd50a-da80-418e-bb46-fcf911811f56-1
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pleasure cries.

b3860a38-c952-4fa1-ad30-165b82f8e7f8-0
00:06:43.360 --> 00:06:48.861
I plunge my finger into my wetness and
move with intentional thrust designed for

b3860a38-c952-4fa1-ad30-165b82f8e7f8-1
00:06:48.861 --> 00:06:49.880
a quick climax.

7a0b6e0b-c43c-4eb1-a17f-40cd0519cb3b-0
00:06:50.680 --> 00:06:58.280
Her likely fake titillating moans change
direction, seeking another's attention.

bde803cd-ab9d-4ed2-8de3-e23b45e6fcfe-0
00:07:00.080 --> 00:07:04.600
Her eyes are on my new neighbour and his
eyes are on me.

3eb0b056-c0a9-452f-8eb5-84b84b416a7a-0
00:07:05.280 --> 00:07:09.296
Still stroking,
still too shy to show me all of him,

3eb0b056-c0a9-452f-8eb5-84b84b416a7a-1
00:07:09.296 --> 00:07:12.480
but not enough to shift his line of sight.

6020bdfa-8e0a-4006-8ac2-79cf7bdd40b3-0
00:07:13.720 --> 00:07:17.080
His pace quickens and his back muscles
tighten.

c377d6af-279a-4016-8309-3de8034597b3-0
00:07:18.600 --> 00:07:23.440
Leaning into the chaos of our unplanned
**** I watch him while listening to her.

9e5bc61b-56cd-4cf5-aa17-1d53f657ad9f-0
00:07:24.280 --> 00:07:28.840
Our synced boisterous moans warn the
neighbourhood we are about to climax.

030930fd-1c27-473b-99c9-a32a01a7eaa9-0
00:07:29.720 --> 00:07:34.932
Loud whimpers simultaneously push from
our three loins,

030930fd-1c27-473b-99c9-a32a01a7eaa9-1
00:07:34.932 --> 00:07:39.121
shiver through our core and exit our
mouths,

030930fd-1c27-473b-99c9-a32a01a7eaa9-2
00:07:39.121 --> 00:07:44.519
an unquestionable signal we are all
thoroughly satisfied.

62ea2684-e2ab-4f10-94ef-2dd7bf5cdb5c-0
00:07:47.560 --> 00:07:51.986
He silences his shower,
his eyes remain averted as he turns to

62ea2684-e2ab-4f10-94ef-2dd7bf5cdb5c-1
00:07:51.986 --> 00:07:53.040
grab his towel.

4886723f-c5d7-454f-9bca-a7ec702333c9-0
00:07:53.400 --> 00:07:59.400
*** **** proudly hanging to the centre of
his thighs, glares at me, taunting me.

67c5e09c-a4e0-417e-8226-df6628499d1e-0
00:08:00.480 --> 00:08:04.880
Chiselled ABS and defined quads serve as
a background to his masterpiece.

f9f875d7-4bee-42c7-b162-11ef192bee10-0
00:08:06.960 --> 00:08:07.920
Who is he?

fa059f91-4abd-4e05-949e-527be1a4616a-0
00:08:11.640 --> 00:08:16.782
Two nights later, at 12:10,
AMI rise from my balcony perch,

fa059f91-4abd-4e05-949e-527be1a4616a-1
00:08:16.782 --> 00:08:22.440
peeling away the silk robe clinging to my
humidity drenched skin.

7c7aaeea-b7f6-4e3b-91b8-16ad34060fdf-0
00:08:23.400 --> 00:08:27.104
A sharp breath escapes at the sight of a
tall,

7c7aaeea-b7f6-4e3b-91b8-16ad34060fdf-1
00:08:27.104 --> 00:08:33.645
recognisable manly silhouette with broad
shoulders and defined arms standing in my

7c7aaeea-b7f6-4e3b-91b8-16ad34060fdf-2
00:08:33.645 --> 00:08:34.040
yard.

3a0b838a-4af7-4141-9ddb-c61a50e79809-0
00:08:35.440 --> 00:08:37.640
Sorry, I didn't mean to scare you.

d1ae19f2-a324-4801-8c83-5f791cf5d5e9-0
00:08:38.200 --> 00:08:41.440
He says with an unapologetic smile.

a221e980-4913-4566-a8d3-820bf76542c1-0
00:08:42.640 --> 00:08:45.800
I'm Cooper, I just moved in next door.

78d554f7-eeaf-4a78-93ab-f5cae8367689-0
00:08:46.280 --> 00:08:48.160
My towel blew off my deck into your yard.

c8b44ffa-7429-4c5c-9e0a-5a1e954b5f7f-0
00:08:48.200 --> 00:08:50.920
I was going to call out,
but I didn't want to interrupt you.

76b8e4c4-7b5e-4032-a8ac-27f0518154bb-0
00:08:52.760 --> 00:08:54.680
Blood rushes to my face.

9a4bad2e-4743-42e7-8f47-b31fe6940a7c-0
00:08:55.640 --> 00:08:58.520
So you just stood there watching?

b62e7a5f-e56a-4cdf-81d4-e284ed1dafaa-0
00:08:58.920 --> 00:09:02.074
I ask,
taking a sip of my wine to gather my

b62e7a5f-e56a-4cdf-81d4-e284ed1dafaa-1
00:09:02.074 --> 00:09:02.720
thoughts.

a2a0f4d9-eaae-481e-872e-08d0b70ac0fe-0
00:09:04.080 --> 00:09:05.000
He shrugs.

ef9ae387-b889-459d-ac12-7926aff50d4d-0
00:09:05.920 --> 00:09:09.200
It's only fair considering you look first.

a8c9cd99-7480-43c3-a7da-46eb4f217a7a-0
00:09:10.360 --> 00:09:11.440
I nearly choke.

36e8058c-f2e6-4605-89fa-62162fefb4b0-0
00:09:12.840 --> 00:09:16.029
Cooper continues,
stepping close enough for me to smell his

36e8058c-f2e6-4605-89fa-62162fefb4b0-1
00:09:16.029 --> 00:09:17.040
lavender body wash.

c09c5ee9-24e3-479a-8c46-4e02a1bc6613-0
00:09:18.200 --> 00:09:19.600
It's OK.

d2aeb62d-11ab-47dc-979b-f45acefd3af8-0
00:09:20.480 --> 00:09:22.240
Outdoor showers make good theatres.

91572b14-53b5-4fe5-ae80-433eb422d43a-0
00:09:23.480 --> 00:09:24.680
I like the show, too.

ea1184f5-b9a0-41b1-80e2-281b31bf61bb-0
00:09:26.040 --> 00:09:32.280
Half mortified, half delighted, I say,
you are very forward.

ded1d674-4cd2-479c-9516-48497bb4575d-0
00:09:33.840 --> 00:09:36.760
I'm a widower, he replies softly.

0f1d236d-0adb-4d5d-a899-b98f0b6e3a46-0
00:09:37.920 --> 00:09:40.360
I've learned not to waste time.

6a80b92f-b0cc-448e-a123-531330fc4fd4-0
00:09:42.440 --> 00:09:46.190
That news,
and it's ensuing familiar silence swell

6a80b92f-b0cc-448e-a123-531330fc4fd4-1
00:09:46.190 --> 00:09:47.000
between us.

dbe4cf46-46ca-48b7-97e0-58688672cefd-0
00:09:48.920 --> 00:09:51.400
Well, if you tell still missing,
let me know.

d5a97f1b-3900-4432-9777-38f90a8ad3ca-0
00:09:51.560 --> 00:09:52.600
I'll look in the morning.

d5a25e02-2825-453f-8dde-443b28fc9347-0
00:09:53.320 --> 00:09:55.680
I'm Molly, by the way.

adf463d1-8d13-4d48-a43a-0f4f9c5cf30e-0
00:09:57.320 --> 00:09:59.640
I sit down, clambering for comfort.

84a6323c-d2c0-4943-95d2-eaa816b2f8b1-0
00:10:00.880 --> 00:10:01.480
I will.

05377956-d5fa-4ab7-b6cc-b1902658f6ca-0
00:10:02.160 --> 00:10:02.920
He grins.

866faa9b-7741-4002-a164-c8353f9f278a-0
00:10:03.960 --> 00:10:10.360
And Molly, if you ever feel like talking,
I'm around.

9746bbb9-39cf-4c25-84b5-9a6aae1ac5c7-0
00:10:11.560 --> 00:10:14.680
It's just me over there.

cc361cb4-5b04-4cc5-8048-2318cd51fcb7-0
00:10:17.200 --> 00:10:21.960
He slips back into his house like a man
who understands the art of good timing.

4afd3c82-f617-4b88-a457-f5f7ce11aaf1-0
00:10:23.400 --> 00:10:29.280
I sit quietly,
my heart unexpectedly light.

1b44efab-3261-483c-9416-ffd4d00657c5-0
00:10:32.760 --> 00:10:38.561
Two nights later at 12:07 AM,
wiggling my toes in the Dewey grass,

1b44efab-3261-483c-9416-ffd4d00657c5-1
00:10:38.561 --> 00:10:42.543
I stare at the shower head hanging
ominously,

1b44efab-3261-483c-9416-ffd4d00657c5-2
00:10:42.543 --> 00:10:46.440
untouched since the summer of Jacob's
death.

9adc1a17-7707-4063-80f3-35fe00735451-0
00:10:47.080 --> 00:10:51.520
Cobwebs thicker than the ones on my
vagina hover in the corner.

2d0b7e68-fa0b-4f2b-b408-0fa6199b33b8-0
00:10:53.800 --> 00:10:57.320
It's just a shower, I whisper.

60678992-f782-4d5d-b4d9-efe27ac0762c-0
00:11:02.000 --> 00:11:05.840
I turn the water on and let my robe slip
off my body.

69a7c288-234c-4a1f-b277-aa983f1a1a1f-0
00:11:07.680 --> 00:11:10.440
Warm water slides down my spine.

e05a394d-ff27-4294-9b62-50d4d98c0347-0
00:11:11.840 --> 00:11:16.920
It's heat loosening the tense anger I've
perfected over these last years.

768b3b95-48b2-4c42-9548-490465a08fdc-0
00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:22.680
I rake my fingers through my hair,
slicking it back.

5f3f023e-cb3b-4ed0-aa65-28986a273787-0
00:11:24.360 --> 00:11:27.360
Curtains move in dimly lit windows.

223778fa-cb28-4b1c-8cf4-97659f3b31e2-0
00:11:29.000 --> 00:11:32.600
Is it the wind or are they watching?

e86d004b-c6a0-469c-8bf7-cca707ada5b6-0
00:11:35.440 --> 00:11:37.920
I turn, presenting myself.

c26efc5c-c6cd-48c8-94b2-38646f0e11ad-0
00:11:38.440 --> 00:11:40.200
I want them to watch.

14b27e28-4845-40bd-b57f-9a4490af002f-0
00:11:41.560 --> 00:11:49.720
This is for no one, for everyone, for me.

dab9e8d8-256d-47be-b9d1-5a36c05dfd23-0
00:11:52.760 --> 00:11:58.993
Moonlight spills across my breasts as I
lather them, caress them,

dab9e8d8-256d-47be-b9d1-5a36c05dfd23-1
00:11:58.993 --> 00:12:02.960
grazing ******* made hard by my own hands.

1b589705-5437-4e11-b8c2-410bab2b4ca0-0
00:12:04.760 --> 00:12:10.185
There is something bold and wickedly
delightful in this act,

1b589705-5437-4e11-b8c2-410bab2b4ca0-1
00:12:10.185 --> 00:12:14.900
Not because it's sexual,
but because it's my moment,

1b589705-5437-4e11-b8c2-410bab2b4ca0-2
00:12:14.900 --> 00:12:18.280
a small taste of freedom from despair.

81078cec-55b7-413f-920a-b64f0c5dd7d9-0
00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:25.515
I bite my lip,
slide my middle finger down to my ****

81078cec-55b7-413f-920a-b64f0c5dd7d9-1
00:12:25.515 --> 00:12:29.240
tracing tight circles ever so slowly.

b0b03805-caa6-4d27-a97d-4f384678ce76-0
00:12:31.120 --> 00:12:37.571
Timidity, sadness,
confidence and excitement swirl, ecstatic,

b0b03805-caa6-4d27-a97d-4f384678ce76-1
00:12:37.571 --> 00:12:44.126
but my skilled finger,
now pulsating like a high end vibrator,

b0b03805-caa6-4d27-a97d-4f384678ce76-2
00:12:44.126 --> 00:12:46.520
cuts through the chaos.

92bdeddc-747b-43f7-ba85-2f18e102d5f1-0
00:12:47.200 --> 00:12:48.640
Eagerness takes hold.

589fe03d-7a50-4fc1-ab4a-ca44872d7873-0
00:12:48.640 --> 00:12:55.261
I slip my finger in and out as the palm
of my hand repeatedly rubs my ****

589fe03d-7a50-4fc1-ab4a-ca44872d7873-1
00:12:55.261 --> 00:12:58.440
seeking a slow and rewarding return.

468630b9-4916-4c2d-9e79-444a7552eb6a-0
00:12:59.240 --> 00:13:02.040
My body quivers from head to toe.

6a793024-45b6-4ca0-bae4-613c06d7c757-0
00:13:05.280 --> 00:13:13.520
Two nights later at 11:55 PMA,
soft clink chimes on my patio table.

ce27df84-2721-49c0-973a-ebc323aa4cac-0
00:13:14.720 --> 00:13:19.640
I move the curtains slightly and see a
glass of wine with a note tucked under.

038ce8de-d6ec-4c6f-9bc0-7c343756c11d-0
00:13:21.120 --> 00:13:27.235
Cooper is already walking back to his
yard wearing only white linen pants and a

038ce8de-d6ec-4c6f-9bc0-7c343756c11d-1
00:13:27.235 --> 00:13:28.000
smug grin.

bd2a0b3a-8f61-4a3a-b17b-bfc5c7c886c1-0
00:13:29.560 --> 00:13:33.080
I wait until he disappears and slip out
the door to read the note.

76c79f44-f0c4-4034-bae5-aa0f2f6a1271-0
00:13:34.800 --> 00:13:35.840
Enjoy the wine.

f02e2860-70fe-4473-9cde-e79db47d394d-0
00:13:36.440 --> 00:13:38.360
This is my favourite Zinfandel.

bc33ec87-6490-4fe1-919e-42f15b9450e4-0
00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:40.840
You missed a good one last night.

4081a463-46dc-4b02-bc78-16451608089c-0
00:13:41.560 --> 00:13:44.640
Couple in the tan house handcuffs.

6cf49437-73df-4afa-87ac-404b56de8907-0
00:13:46.080 --> 00:13:52.355
I laugh aloud for the first time in years
as I walk back into the house and curl up

6cf49437-73df-4afa-87ac-404b56de8907-1
00:13:52.355 --> 00:13:55.120
in bed, consumed by a single thought.

6adb1c50-085e-4d96-a19e-b20fd284e55e-0
00:13:55.120 --> 00:13:59.260
I **** my clip,
purposely imagining someone who isn't

6adb1c50-085e-4d96-a19e-b20fd284e55e-1
00:13:59.260 --> 00:13:59.720
Jacob.

e77e460e-f113-4f2d-81df-5e9e342f442e-0
00:14:03.600 --> 00:14:09.120
Two nights later, at 9:15 PM, knock,
knock.

80106761-75ac-4cd9-833d-0d5d6965eb03-0
00:14:10.360 --> 00:14:14.760
Cooper is standing at the door,
dripping wet, holding a grocery bag.

c839d5c2-e061-45a3-8c69-35efb07f4fa6-0
00:14:16.160 --> 00:14:20.658
Looks like the rain is putting a damper
on tonight's entertainment and I can't

c839d5c2-e061-45a3-8c69-35efb07f4fa6-1
00:14:20.658 --> 00:14:22.480
eat this tub of ice cream alone.

df317f57-f4ba-4d45-9700-38f00a348c94-0
00:14:24.000 --> 00:14:29.597
We sit by the back window and with each
lightning flash I catch a clearer glimpse

df317f57-f4ba-4d45-9700-38f00a348c94-1
00:14:29.597 --> 00:14:31.440
of his telling smile lines.

f4d26be4-d641-4874-a146-0e4d09696827-0
00:14:33.160 --> 00:14:36.320
So how are you liking the new house?

40e16bcf-5596-4e3e-9f4d-4d9048b64cdd-0
00:14:36.480 --> 00:14:37.200
I ask.

5219ef5c-6b93-4445-b3a3-99ca5e8aa54b-0
00:14:38.600 --> 00:14:41.080
It's different, which is what I needed.

808ac070-69c0-4a00-89a6-cc5e999a35a7-0
00:14:42.080 --> 00:14:43.600
Feels good.

a688e29d-442e-4069-8122-17eeedd63ee5-0
00:14:45.680 --> 00:14:47.720
Did the move help you get over her?

dc05d23b-7cca-4889-9c0d-87d4491fa1db-0
00:14:49.480 --> 00:14:53.240
It hasn't erased the pain,
but it's given me a new sense of hope.

a2492897-1204-4201-89fa-3015372d650d-0
00:14:54.000 --> 00:14:55.480
It's like a spark ignited.

24fbac3f-6ad0-4e11-8301-3923f9585ab0-0
00:14:58.160 --> 00:15:04.880
He holds my arm,
letting me know he's ready for more.

c35b92ad-995e-4a92-b70e-5b9099a84a0b-0
00:15:06.880 --> 00:15:07.560
I'm not.

176dc04c-4b14-44af-800c-4eaf846f558e-0
00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:18.120
The next night at 11:59 PM,
another note sits on my back table.

fa5de7bb-84fd-49e4-b808-7d78c6d2aa75-0
00:15:20.160 --> 00:15:22.320
I haven't stopped thinking about you.

1dfcb05f-04c0-450f-94c2-f567846bd943-0
00:15:23.800 --> 00:15:24.840
Come join me.

91945b96-e488-40ed-adc5-9d16f20bad92-0
00:15:25.800 --> 00:15:32.073
Not for a new beginning,
just for a moment in time with an open

91945b96-e488-40ed-adc5-9d16f20bad92-1
00:15:32.073 --> 00:15:32.760
ending.

f294c8b8-bd16-41a6-bd15-02cf8b23c0a3-0
00:15:34.880 --> 00:15:39.240
I hover at the edge of my porch,
clenching the stairs railing.

ece2469b-f9bc-40a9-9662-2169afc1ae96-0
00:15:40.400 --> 00:15:44.000
The air is thick with salt and silence.

fe6ca590-e24e-4834-84ae-a9ee5f11a70d-0
00:15:45.000 --> 00:15:49.920
My bare feet sink into the cold stairs
and wood creaks under me.

76acbf49-73a2-40dc-a049-c7d0bf36aa7f-0
00:15:51.480 --> 00:15:59.375
Each step down is slow and deliberate,
as if every descent is a choice I've been

76acbf49-73a2-40dc-a049-c7d0bf36aa7f-1
00:15:59.375 --> 00:16:01.520
putting off for years.

bf337ef0-d6d0-45a8-8e42-75bc8b0b020f-0
00:16:05.560 --> 00:16:09.072
Next door,
the steady rush of a shower hammering

bf337ef0-d6d0-45a8-8e42-75bc8b0b020f-1
00:16:09.072 --> 00:16:13.445
against rocky surfaces blends with the
pounding of my heart,

bf337ef0-d6d0-45a8-8e42-75bc8b0b020f-2
00:16:13.445 --> 00:16:16.600
both echoing in the stillness of the
night.

6438bcc6-bc62-4cb1-92b9-f0e8ca23c694-0
00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:24.804
Steam curls into the night,
veiling the outlines of his body,

6438bcc6-bc62-4cb1-92b9-f0e8ca23c694-1
00:16:24.804 --> 00:16:26.960
but not quite enough.

86ccc30e-99b7-4d89-8f1c-419352212990-0
00:16:29.440 --> 00:16:32.280
I drop my robe and step inside the shower.

0f6ddfd8-c5d8-477b-afd5-88f86dee68df-0
00:16:32.280 --> 00:16:37.360
Without a word,
Cooper turns entirely towards me.

56d9c647-dbaf-458e-ad91-6451ccbb6c70-0
00:16:39.400 --> 00:16:46.952
Our eyes meet and I feel that same
bothersome excitement that has been on my

56d9c647-dbaf-458e-ad91-6451ccbb6c70-1
00:16:46.952 --> 00:16:50.680
mind for days as the water engulfs me.

079c2942-7d07-4bde-a17f-5a757ebbadf4-0
00:16:50.680 --> 00:16:59.759
I let go of everything I've been trying
to put behind me and it washes down the

079c2942-7d07-4bde-a17f-5a757ebbadf4-1
00:16:59.759 --> 00:17:00.440
drain.

1b921985-95bc-4150-9bec-f0f1d1414a7d-0
00:17:22.170 --> 00:17:26.130
So thank you Jenny E for your sexy story.

feb96cfe-dd75-4e67-b2e5-36caf9803ceb-0
00:17:27.090 --> 00:17:32.610
I need a shower, Jenny,
an outdoor shower specifically.

2cf1142b-5aaa-483e-9421-9bf1708fb3fb-0
00:17:33.170 --> 00:17:36.978
So before we get into the story,
we actually had a chat with Elise,

2cf1142b-5aaa-483e-9421-9bf1708fb3fb-1
00:17:36.978 --> 00:17:41.290
our guest judge for the category,
who shared their thoughts about the story.

9d0eb2a3-dce1-4cd6-b880-31a353175c7b-0
00:17:41.290 --> 00:17:44.170
So we will play that discussion now.

1cb1b5c8-62aa-4fad-add8-2b0f631dbaa8-0
00:17:47.200 --> 00:17:47.920
Hello Elise.

c2d119a9-048d-4189-9d17-483e37b9a526-0
00:17:48.120 --> 00:17:51.160
Hi,
tell us your thoughts about this story.

bf44e600-f854-4f86-ad64-ad8963d94be0-0
00:17:51.320 --> 00:17:52.720
I really enjoyed this story.

25212063-da0b-468d-9978-ca985afea11f-0
00:17:52.720 --> 00:17:54.760
The premise of it was a lot of fun for me.

588b1153-ced2-45d4-b18c-9d693993d1c8-0
00:17:54.760 --> 00:17:57.534
I have,
I have never been to a physical community

588b1153-ced2-45d4-b18c-9d693993d1c8-1
00:17:57.534 --> 00:18:01.640
of voyeurists and exhibitionists,
but I've known groups or communities of

588b1153-ced2-45d4-b18c-9d693993d1c8-2
00:18:01.640 --> 00:18:06.080
voyeurists and exhibitionists who get
together and do like little kink parties.

039da7d3-bebd-4794-950e-f9bb732b31ba-0
00:18:06.080 --> 00:18:09.920
So seeing it taken to the next level was
really enjoyable for me.

e199da4e-d942-4da5-ac29-eff9ddc180f0-0
00:18:10.280 --> 00:18:12.560
This is though, a bare devil, right?

078ec90a-5eb6-4e1b-8720-30a0fd9398a3-0
00:18:12.560 --> 00:18:14.600
So I'm not supposed to be all bubbly and
kind.

63b1af76-4f13-4d18-a514-32e15708e9c4-0
00:18:16.880 --> 00:18:18.800
Yeah, we don't go easy on our bare devils.

ff4e0246-9b53-4ee6-8664-4fb865ef7def-0
00:18:19.080 --> 00:18:23.413
But you bring that up and it's it's
interesting because Ed's initial comments

ff4e0246-9b53-4ee6-8664-4fb865ef7def-1
00:18:23.413 --> 00:18:26.357
on this story,
after reading your comments was like,

ff4e0246-9b53-4ee6-8664-4fb865ef7def-2
00:18:26.357 --> 00:18:27.079
hang on what?

0866379d-c63c-4367-b376-2b7c806e9a0c-0
00:18:27.080 --> 00:18:28.760
These communities exist?

fce462b1-ce26-45ae-9f0e-6df77328124f-0
00:18:28.760 --> 00:18:31.000
I've been living in the wrong area my
whole life.

a9866548-71ec-45ca-adb8-8df7ca1e690a-0
00:18:31.360 --> 00:18:31.560
Yeah.

e1635872-f026-4b2c-8c6a-93e276a65c01-0
00:18:31.560 --> 00:18:35.954
I wasn't sure based on your comment is
are these established communities solely

e1635872-f026-4b2c-8c6a-93e276a65c01-1
00:18:35.954 --> 00:18:40.294
for this purpose or are they little sub
communities that arise out of existing

e1635872-f026-4b2c-8c6a-93e276a65c01-2
00:18:40.294 --> 00:18:43.920
locations where people who live there are
on the same wavelength?

c03a1371-f31e-4120-b891-412b841b1ee0-0
00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:48.875
I would assume the latter 'cause I have
not across a community where it's like

c03a1371-f31e-4120-b891-412b841b1ee0-1
00:18:48.875 --> 00:18:53.293
the ethos of the community that everyone
like goes outside and, you know,

c03a1371-f31e-4120-b891-412b841b1ee0-2
00:18:53.293 --> 00:18:55.920
engages in exhibitionist sexual
activities.

b0fc5795-0c9d-4356-b8f3-a3a0d5a2ea5f-0
00:18:55.920 --> 00:19:00.307
So what I am much more familiar with is
where a person who's ***** and has maybe

b0fc5795-0c9d-4356-b8f3-a3a0d5a2ea5f-1
00:19:00.307 --> 00:19:03.720
a house or a property that's like
expansive or private enough,

b0fc5795-0c9d-4356-b8f3-a3a0d5a2ea5f-2
00:19:03.720 --> 00:19:06.320
we'll have a party and everyone will come
over.

9f889957-393b-4ec3-8a8e-2cf2767c3801-0
00:19:06.320 --> 00:19:09.667
And so there's munches,
which are vanilla friendly parties where

9f889957-393b-4ec3-8a8e-2cf2767c3801-1
00:19:09.667 --> 00:19:13.632
anybody is welcome and you can come to
the, it sounds naughty, but it's not,

9f889957-393b-4ec3-8a8e-2cf2767c3801-2
00:19:13.632 --> 00:19:15.280
it's the one that's not naughty.

746beb4f-d1a5-4684-9a39-2359fd75dd24-0
00:19:15.680 --> 00:19:19.440
You go to a munch to learn about the kink
lifestyle and to meet ***** people.

83f8fb84-a895-4ffb-9ab6-ac10087c9602-0
00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:22.071
And you can,
there might be people like in a collar or

83f8fb84-a895-4ffb-9ab6-ac10087c9602-1
00:19:22.071 --> 00:19:25.180
leash or like in a corseted up or wearing
the boots or whatever,

83f8fb84-a895-4ffb-9ab6-ac10087c9602-2
00:19:25.180 --> 00:19:28.960
but there's not going to be any like
really ******** kink going on at a month.

e3012bcd-66d2-4878-abcc-7a554701761c-0
00:19:28.960 --> 00:19:32.613
You're not going to like see blood play
or anything like that,

e3012bcd-66d2-4878-abcc-7a554701761c-1
00:19:32.613 --> 00:19:37.309
but then once you're in the community,
then you can get invited to ***** parties

e3012bcd-66d2-4878-abcc-7a554701761c-2
00:19:37.309 --> 00:19:41.832
that have themes to them or maybe are
just like a place where everyone can go

e3012bcd-66d2-4878-abcc-7a554701761c-3
00:19:41.832 --> 00:19:45.079
for an evening or a weekend and just kind
of let loose.

2e25c07a-fe59-4c14-a48a-efa2d470864c-0
00:19:45.120 --> 00:19:48.240
What you're trying to say is that these
munch parties are like in a moose bouche.

25cf9bde-3514-42e6-a1dd-8b4e867982b5-0
00:19:48.280 --> 00:19:51.200
So take a little munch.

9205ca58-775e-471c-b19f-97cdf7198329-0
00:19:51.480 --> 00:19:54.600
But tell us your thoughts on this story
in particular as well.

9b096951-03cc-47d6-aadd-ff15a1156b1b-0
00:19:54.600 --> 00:19:57.240
So I know Jenny was keen for your
feedback.

11a63951-c009-4125-a9b6-2dc76ea2220d-0
00:19:57.520 --> 00:19:57.840
Yeah.

3bf398ee-5d46-4f56-b453-2dffb3c83014-0
00:19:57.880 --> 00:20:02.346
So one of the things that I really loved
was the way that the voyeurism and

3bf398ee-5d46-4f56-b453-2dffb3c83014-1
00:20:02.346 --> 00:20:06.812
exhibitionism piece of the story was
almost like a character the individual

3bf398ee-5d46-4f56-b453-2dffb3c83014-2
00:20:06.812 --> 00:20:10.808
participants in this community didn't
really flesh out as separate,

3bf398ee-5d46-4f56-b453-2dffb3c83014-3
00:20:10.808 --> 00:20:12.159
rich characters for me.

870dd34b-5d73-4355-a7cb-9c2da813a719-0
00:20:12.480 --> 00:20:15.290
And with more space,
that's something I really would have

870dd34b-5d73-4355-a7cb-9c2da813a719-1
00:20:15.290 --> 00:20:15.920
loved to see.

7dc72665-f16e-4fa6-a593-1dd4e63936dd-0
00:20:16.080 --> 00:20:21.298
But the main purpose of the community was
a vehicle for the healing journey of this

7dc72665-f16e-4fa6-a593-1dd4e63936dd-1
00:20:21.298 --> 00:20:21.920
character.

b3895020-05f0-4a44-b9ce-55750c1da1ff-0
00:20:21.920 --> 00:20:25.706
So like so many ***** people,
there's like a healing arc embedded in

b3895020-05f0-4a44-b9ce-55750c1da1ff-1
00:20:25.706 --> 00:20:26.200
the kink.

47f33f96-63c2-4bf8-ae5b-fe56ae6bb704-0
00:20:26.360 --> 00:20:27.440
And for her, it was like.

ed521a99-f01c-4f64-af3f-12e81f3e44c7-0
00:20:27.520 --> 00:20:32.267
Like releasing was kind of her core theme
and I felt like the role that the other

ed521a99-f01c-4f64-af3f-12e81f3e44c7-1
00:20:32.267 --> 00:20:36.435
exhibitionists and voyeurists in the
community were playing for her was

ed521a99-f01c-4f64-af3f-12e81f3e44c7-2
00:20:36.435 --> 00:20:40.720
holding that space so that there were the
slow releasing became possible.

890b9029-17f1-4eee-9db2-fe167e77ea5d-0
00:20:41.120 --> 00:20:45.630
There were very specific moments of
vulnerability for her in the times that

890b9029-17f1-4eee-9db2-fe167e77ea5d-1
00:20:45.630 --> 00:20:49.014
she was watching,
like the moment where it says he lifts

890b9029-17f1-4eee-9db2-fe167e77ea5d-2
00:20:49.014 --> 00:20:52.160
her and she instinctively wraps her legs
around him.

15ec1fd1-d030-4e70-b634-ca80dffd0161-0
00:20:52.200 --> 00:20:55.640
A few pelvic presses later,
he loses his grip, and they laugh.

ed85cf96-0ff4-4740-a6e6-16d1075ce5f3-0
00:20:56.000 --> 00:21:00.160
And this moment of, like, you know,
sex isn't always perfect.

d38a46e5-d29f-4bca-85b4-f2ed857b8cda-0
00:21:00.160 --> 00:21:02.680
It's not like the way that we remember
when we're grieving.

55380411-cfdc-4db2-a134-6adc3a94a914-0
00:21:02.680 --> 00:21:05.720
It's sloppy and awkward and damp.

4ff0e735-f0f2-44b0-a5ad-e05b4bb3edb0-0
00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:09.680
And then that almost.

db29bcdd-3fad-491d-9667-d7cce12a9f74-0
00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:12.560
That's hot, moist, moist.

a1131acd-ea8e-4d6e-9f3f-3717844f0a7f-0
00:21:12.560 --> 00:21:13.240
Exactly.

03d4a88e-537b-48c1-8c50-bb6ec445e9f5-0
00:21:13.280 --> 00:21:13.920
No, you're right.

5b57d2ef-a99a-45af-95e6-447fde9520eb-0
00:21:13.920 --> 00:21:16.160
I think that moment resonated with me as
well.

5521051a-184c-4ef1-81b3-6a64f65e689a-0
00:21:16.160 --> 00:21:18.240
Like, you know,
and I think the words are used there.

521eaea3-253e-48f4-9588-2a65c0c60722-0
00:21:18.240 --> 00:21:18.840
It's real.

8a0f2f89-0851-4bab-adcd-378f9bfa8d42-0
00:21:18.920 --> 00:21:19.120
Yeah.

30df365b-1524-438a-a2fe-d27d63218b2c-0
00:21:19.120 --> 00:21:21.120
It's not all the fantasy.

61a1fd9d-4903-4620-ac2d-8a6fdd079dc0-0
00:21:21.120 --> 00:21:24.385
There's, there's like,
human connection that happens in that

61a1fd9d-4903-4620-ac2d-8a6fdd079dc0-1
00:21:24.385 --> 00:21:24.760
moment.

e69f2fc0-3d40-4250-bcf7-2a74f903fc92-0
00:21:24.760 --> 00:21:27.760
And I thought that was conveyed very well
in this story.

45b03450-4704-4975-8ea1-7723f90dd48c-0
00:21:27.760 --> 00:21:32.480
And and I did get that sort of emotional
punch from that moment in the story.

7c4469b1-6389-43ea-bb53-d3127ef27d5c-0
00:21:32.640 --> 00:21:33.440
I did too.

6f03b142-69cf-404c-b4bd-c824728f3b00-0
00:21:33.960 --> 00:21:35.160
I did wish so.

4a643292-e1f3-48db-8784-4ce55c86b8a4-0
00:21:35.160 --> 00:21:38.719
The character has like this journey of
releasing,

4a643292-e1f3-48db-8784-4ce55c86b8a4-1
00:21:38.719 --> 00:21:43.702
and the latter half of the journey is
sort of facilitated through her

4a643292-e1f3-48db-8784-4ce55c86b8a4-2
00:21:43.702 --> 00:21:47.759
attraction to and eventually her assume
sex with Cooper.

aeea4280-211a-4f2a-9f2f-95be42eba457-0
00:21:48.200 --> 00:21:49.400
And I like that.

2cb4ef60-8a1e-4a7b-9bad-e780ab0ce50c-0
00:21:49.680 --> 00:21:53.949
Where I really struggled with this story
was that I didn't feel as though at the

2cb4ef60-8a1e-4a7b-9bad-e780ab0ce50c-1
00:21:53.949 --> 00:21:57.323
end the sort of like,
and then all of my issues washed down the

2cb4ef60-8a1e-4a7b-9bad-e780ab0ce50c-2
00:21:57.323 --> 00:21:57.640
drain.

35e9c93c-7233-4732-853a-45339f8777bc-0
00:21:57.640 --> 00:22:01.386
Peace was a very satisfying resolution
because at least for me,

35e9c93c-7233-4732-853a-45339f8777bc-1
00:22:01.386 --> 00:22:06.187
grief is so much more complex than that
and kink can be so much more complex than

35e9c93c-7233-4732-853a-45339f8777bc-2
00:22:06.187 --> 00:22:06.480
that.

f525137a-c919-477e-b9da-86be80e6def5-0
00:22:06.480 --> 00:22:10.445
So this vehicle gives you a lot of room
to play with the pieces of that that are

f525137a-c919-477e-b9da-86be80e6def5-1
00:22:10.445 --> 00:22:13.040
carried and then the pieces of it that
are released.

c6bc1f9a-29da-4e43-a9ce-cb4fa8aee6fc-0
00:22:13.320 --> 00:22:16.782
And maybe it was an issue of word count
because that is a pretty big ask for such

c6bc1f9a-29da-4e43-a9ce-cb4fa8aee6fc-1
00:22:16.782 --> 00:22:17.120
a short.

489ac119-011f-4e67-9aa9-c4c974b47f9d-0
00:22:17.600 --> 00:22:21.300
I would have loved to see there were a
couple of spots where,

489ac119-011f-4e67-9aa9-c4c974b47f9d-1
00:22:21.300 --> 00:22:25.360
like the second to last paragraph,
Cooper turns entirely toward me.

0669db16-70e3-4ada-9259-f93e49fdfe7e-0
00:22:25.360 --> 00:22:29.760
Our eyes meet and I feel that same
bothersome excitement that has been on my

0669db16-70e3-4ada-9259-f93e49fdfe7e-1
00:22:29.760 --> 00:22:30.560
mind for days.

943688d5-e7f5-4321-b9d8-8c1f9f0d5221-0
00:22:30.560 --> 00:22:35.440
And I love the sense of conflictedness in
that word bothersome.

295f1ef8-c134-4813-9dec-c2e6995f3a8b-0
00:22:35.800 --> 00:22:39.973
But if the next line that is like I let
go of everything I've been trying to put

295f1ef8-c134-4813-9dec-c2e6995f3a8b-1
00:22:39.973 --> 00:22:42.240
behind me and it all washes down the
drain.

42beebc5-77e9-498f-bb45-e63e1895007b-0
00:22:42.240 --> 00:22:46.830
I feel like that moment of opportunity
that is offered by the word bothersome or

42beebc5-77e9-498f-bb45-e63e1895007b-1
00:22:46.830 --> 00:22:50.400
even a more evocative and powerful world
word like traitorous,

42beebc5-77e9-498f-bb45-e63e1895007b-2
00:22:50.400 --> 00:22:54.366
if that's how she's feeling,
could have lent a lot more ambiguity and

42beebc5-77e9-498f-bb45-e63e1895007b-3
00:22:54.366 --> 00:22:55.840
complexity to that moment.

cbc81bbc-5a9b-4800-9ad4-2eee10a100fd-0
00:22:55.840 --> 00:22:59.267
And so instead of giving us kind of like
an uncomplicated HEA,

cbc81bbc-5a9b-4800-9ad4-2eee10a100fd-1
00:22:59.267 --> 00:23:02.640
we could have had something a little more
subtle and nuanced.

86513a2d-effb-4cc6-a270-039df258e20e-0
00:23:02.720 --> 00:23:03.600
I would have loved to.

71a46f5f-b194-42b4-8b13-f98af49374b8-0
00:23:04.480 --> 00:23:06.040
I agree very strongly with you.

05013e48-8f1f-47b2-b83f-16d3e955e7de-0
00:23:06.040 --> 00:23:10.857
I think for me and Ed and I might talk
about it in more detail a bit later as

05013e48-8f1f-47b2-b83f-16d3e955e7de-1
00:23:10.857 --> 00:23:13.637
well,
but that that final line I found quite

05013e48-8f1f-47b2-b83f-16d3e955e7de-2
00:23:13.637 --> 00:23:14.440
unsatisfying.

35923a6e-d49b-4b1b-ab48-0960dc89c2a7-0
00:23:14.800 --> 00:23:16.360
I have my own grief.

61384b5c-4651-4cbd-8227-cdb48cf3f351-0
00:23:16.360 --> 00:23:17.440
It's not this kind of grief.

1f6c9837-6465-4f18-b7a4-68bf02af9ac3-0
00:23:17.440 --> 00:23:21.037
I haven't lost a partner,
but I have experienced quite significant

1f6c9837-6465-4f18-b7a4-68bf02af9ac3-1
00:23:21.037 --> 00:23:21.360
grief.

15e62f98-af22-4a6b-8522-4b6dafa59431-0
00:23:21.360 --> 00:23:26.440
And I think this idea of washing it down
the drain didn't resonate with me.

09606841-ffe5-4eb7-8e9c-1839595f5b1a-0
00:23:26.440 --> 00:23:29.494
From my perspective,
that's not what you do with a profound

09606841-ffe5-4eb7-8e9c-1839595f5b1a-1
00:23:29.494 --> 00:23:29.800
grief.

7d739c73-0b59-4b64-a145-50765c1715a5-0
00:23:29.840 --> 00:23:31.280
It never washes down the drain.

c2a40953-5ea8-4404-b4d6-42658c89fb8c-0
00:23:31.280 --> 00:23:32.200
It's always with you.

db210cf9-4032-48b0-9e7b-65e218dc587f-0
00:23:32.440 --> 00:23:34.440
And I think there were other options
there.

9ec18847-624b-4e89-be73-247d7330cad3-0
00:23:34.440 --> 00:23:36.360
I think the sentiment was right.

a8fe891c-e58b-4c19-8df2-f21ac922334d-0
00:23:36.440 --> 00:23:39.327
You know, this idea of like,
I've been holding on to all this stuff

a8fe891c-e58b-4c19-8df2-f21ac922334d-1
00:23:39.327 --> 00:23:41.280
and the idea is that she wants to release
it.

0d7096cf-634e-48a9-ba4b-fba75addb109-0
00:23:41.320 --> 00:23:43.800
And I think that that sentiment is good.

f5f2b4af-59a6-41d5-a281-888f54a90993-0
00:23:43.800 --> 00:23:46.400
And that's a powerful and resonant
sentiment.

c82fc2cc-aae7-429e-9c4a-2fdc890f08f0-0
00:23:46.400 --> 00:23:49.326
And in that moment,
I think it's just that metaphor of

c82fc2cc-aae7-429e-9c4a-2fdc890f08f0-1
00:23:49.326 --> 00:23:52.200
washing down the drain that didn't quite
land for me.

0fe47080-15fc-4804-a777-704007ea075c-0
00:23:52.200 --> 00:23:54.696
And it sounds like it didn't quite land
for you either, Elise,

0fe47080-15fc-4804-a777-704007ea075c-1
00:23:54.696 --> 00:23:56.360
and that maybe there was another metaphor.

85a7e54d-06b7-4737-9002-82acd54ef1d7-0
00:23:56.520 --> 00:23:59.746
And, you know, in this story,
we do talk about the steam as well,

85a7e54d-06b7-4737-9002-82acd54ef1d7-1
00:23:59.746 --> 00:24:00.920
the steam of the shower.

d7c13e56-f7ff-42cb-97cd-11dc08edc828-0
00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:03.200
Like that grief might be the steam.

d6d4f93d-18dc-4fd5-85e2-c121a5a037f8-0
00:24:03.200 --> 00:24:05.600
Like, it's there,
but you can't quite grasp at it.

c7f4fe1f-6031-470a-8c8c-84d805a2c4ad-0
00:24:05.600 --> 00:24:09.747
Like there are other metaphors that I
think might have lent into that release

c7f4fe1f-6031-470a-8c8c-84d805a2c4ad-1
00:24:09.747 --> 00:24:13.895
without giving this idea of, Oh, well,
it's all just gone now and disappeared

c7f4fe1f-6031-470a-8c8c-84d805a2c4ad-2
00:24:13.895 --> 00:24:17.565
and we don't see it ever again,
which is what I would associate with

c7f4fe1f-6031-470a-8c8c-84d805a2c4ad-3
00:24:17.565 --> 00:24:19.320
something washing down the drain.

4c80373d-267b-4d26-91e3-b6d4d7ac3842-0
00:24:19.480 --> 00:24:22.240
There are some moments of rigidness too.

c5654ee0-6728-4c15-b0fb-2dc1a31cf2da-0
00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:24.280
There's the cobwebby vagina.

0e5ea958-de04-4e18-ba3e-7ab5d5becbcd-0
00:24:24.280 --> 00:24:27.240
It's like essentially locked away.

e6c35127-e3b7-45c3-b2dc-8ab38720bc7e-0
00:24:27.240 --> 00:24:30.956
And there are other moments where the
overarching experience that I get of the

e6c35127-e3b7-45c3-b2dc-8ab38720bc7e-1
00:24:30.956 --> 00:24:34.720
main character is this rigidness or this
being like locked down or locked away.

009b8214-d1c2-422a-a5ab-ffe7bc50e962-0
00:24:35.080 --> 00:24:39.566
And I feel like if you're exploring
relief and you're really attached to that

009b8214-d1c2-422a-a5ab-ffe7bc50e962-1
00:24:39.566 --> 00:24:42.673
drain metaphor,
instead of everything being released,

009b8214-d1c2-422a-a5ab-ffe7bc50e962-2
00:24:42.673 --> 00:24:47.102
just the resistance to moving forward
would be a really beautiful, you know,

009b8214-d1c2-422a-a5ab-ffe7bc50e962-3
00:24:47.102 --> 00:24:51.071
the feeling that sadness still and maybe
even feeling that twinge of

009b8214-d1c2-422a-a5ab-ffe7bc50e962-4
00:24:51.071 --> 00:24:52.280
traitorousness still.

784132cc-0bf2-47fa-a6db-93d5d72873b6-0
00:24:52.280 --> 00:24:56.800
But also finally,
like relaxing into that moment.

80e4fe63-d851-4554-bcf8-5dbb5a5d6d17-0
00:24:56.800 --> 00:24:59.320
About halfway through, there's a line.

e59f9376-dfa1-4854-a430-54694df2ad93-0
00:24:59.640 --> 00:25:02.040
He holds my arm letting me know he's
ready for more.

0e64ef5a-62ae-4016-83b6-53ba14f1f05d-0
00:25:02.320 --> 00:25:03.080
I'm not.

5b9c676e-6517-4fb0-a5ee-4f0761caf322-0
00:25:04.360 --> 00:25:09.080
And that's another moment where like the
abruptness of that statement and then the

5b9c676e-6517-4fb0-a5ee-4f0761caf322-1
00:25:09.080 --> 00:25:12.720
transition to the next night being like,
Oh yeah, OK, now I am.

34c24ec5-f4e0-4049-ab23-3aae589240c3-0
00:25:13.120 --> 00:25:14.560
I wasn't, but now I am.

00f07d0c-375f-4585-846b-094a39c2a261-0
00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:20.040
Feels maybe like another opportunity to
have more vulnerability and uncertainty.

2305c003-4b87-4b47-8a31-24d9d4af6217-0
00:25:20.160 --> 00:25:21.080
Yeah, I think you're right.

9a6d2f2f-57d3-48d3-99fb-91ebbf58d0ac-0
00:25:21.080 --> 00:25:23.080
And you're right that it's, you know,
it's a short story.

54d50bda-d9e8-4d9d-979b-e35ca9eaca06-0
00:25:23.080 --> 00:25:26.119
In fact, in my comments,
I was saying this would make an amazing

54d50bda-d9e8-4d9d-979b-e35ca9eaca06-1
00:25:26.119 --> 00:25:26.400
novel.

0152aefe-da8a-4015-bc19-844c1f009ccf-0
00:25:26.840 --> 00:25:29.400
And some stories are too big for the word
count.

9b0167e1-c868-444d-91f8-e22b27595ba1-0
00:25:29.400 --> 00:25:32.200
I think this story did well within the
word count.

81cc1aa3-55ef-4751-a3c9-f856174ecbca-0
00:25:32.200 --> 00:25:35.800
I think it's probably a big ask to,
you know, ask it to do everything.

1981b037-4c2a-4a60-8804-8c727ced9876-0
00:25:36.400 --> 00:25:39.467
And it's the conflict,
this inner conflict of I want this but I

1981b037-4c2a-4a60-8804-8c727ced9876-1
00:25:39.467 --> 00:25:42.200
don't want this or I want this but I'm
not ready for it.

2180f8fd-6ae1-40ba-b995-945b3019bcb2-0
00:25:42.680 --> 00:25:46.320
And it's such an important emotion to
explore.

5f24f242-82f6-41ee-b9dd-0995bc7ab510-0
00:25:46.320 --> 00:25:48.560
And I think that Jenny does that really
well here.

ab425695-e157-4971-a790-f7d0a38f436a-0
00:25:48.920 --> 00:25:51.709
But yeah,
we don't ever quite get the opportunity

ab425695-e157-4971-a790-f7d0a38f436a-1
00:25:51.709 --> 00:25:56.172
to really delve into it because we're
kind of at this surface level and jumping

ab425695-e157-4971-a790-f7d0a38f436a-2
00:25:56.172 --> 00:25:57.400
from moment to moment.

1e02cdc1-d292-45ca-995e-278aa9a28278-0
00:25:57.760 --> 00:26:00.579
But I love how you frame that about I
want this,

1e02cdc1-d292-45ca-995e-278aa9a28278-1
00:26:00.579 --> 00:26:05.296
but I don't want it because that is such
a core aspect of the kink experience for

1e02cdc1-d292-45ca-995e-278aa9a28278-2
00:26:05.296 --> 00:26:06.160
so many people.

6735dcce-7d31-43f2-a782-54978a9395ea-0
00:26:06.760 --> 00:26:09.760
Like I want to feel shame because then I
can release it.

8d207cbe-31c7-407d-922c-0ea0d263d223-0
00:26:09.760 --> 00:26:11.440
So I need someone to shame me.

5ff07013-af35-450f-b0f2-b0a225aace90-0
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:12.400
OK, you see.

5ad90785-4ec5-4ae7-b1a4-407dc472334b-0
00:26:12.680 --> 00:26:15.000
But I don't actually like to be shamed.

70b26503-4a0a-4e80-9020-a3b5f15d9333-0
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:17.520
I just need the release of being shamed.

ca598091-4b0b-4990-8704-f0b3b70137de-0
00:26:17.520 --> 00:26:18.680
That kind of dynamic.

ea23f93b-6a37-460a-86ca-b28f2108f890-0
00:26:18.920 --> 00:26:22.319
I think particularly with the voyeurist
and exhibitionist,

ea23f93b-6a37-460a-86ca-b28f2108f890-1
00:26:22.319 --> 00:26:27.160
that being seen and the seeing peace and
the sort of wanting and not wanting peace.

b247ab13-f3f5-4826-ad69-0bdf9fc0bf2e-0
00:26:27.160 --> 00:26:32.539
There's so much opportunity to explore
how incomplete grieving always is,

b247ab13-f3f5-4826-ad69-0bdf9fc0bf2e-1
00:26:32.539 --> 00:26:36.320
like forever, you know,
you never are done with it.

f3a3f40e-1d50-4e52-90f4-cf29105a3bc1-0
00:26:36.400 --> 00:26:38.988
It's,
it's more about learning to live with the

f3a3f40e-1d50-4e52-90f4-cf29105a3bc1-1
00:26:38.988 --> 00:26:42.762
feeling of that empty spot where
something used to be and learning to

f3a3f40e-1d50-4e52-90f4-cf29105a3bc1-2
00:26:42.762 --> 00:26:47.022
carry it and move forward with it and
eventually take comfort in it instead of

f3a3f40e-1d50-4e52-90f4-cf29105a3bc1-3
00:26:47.022 --> 00:26:48.639
just letting it be washed off.

679c0095-b556-427c-9f42-63d71570aa9f-0
00:26:48.920 --> 00:26:52.071
I think as an extension of that,
there's a line in the story and it's a

679c0095-b556-427c-9f42-63d71570aa9f-1
00:26:52.071 --> 00:26:55.004
line of dialogue, you know,
where they're talking about him moving

679c0095-b556-427c-9f42-63d71570aa9f-2
00:26:55.004 --> 00:26:55.880
into this community.

513bcb79-9ed7-4e6c-b89d-b305ebebb5b3-0
00:26:56.320 --> 00:26:59.640
And she says to him,
did the move help you get over her?

9c941741-78fc-4ffa-80a1-8655a1f27f1e-0
00:27:00.080 --> 00:27:03.320
And he says, it hasn't erased the pain,
but it has given me a new sense of hope.

837027d5-649e-4494-9179-206e16048ea3-0
00:27:03.320 --> 00:27:05.200
It's like a spark ignited.

b0943b0b-7eed-4b03-a050-78d94b8b0e4a-0
00:27:05.600 --> 00:27:07.080
And again,
I think that's a nice sentiment.

38592c23-bd96-4b14-8b98-df48a090ba4e-0
00:27:07.080 --> 00:27:10.760
But at the same time,
that really didn't quite hit home for me.

4d034cbb-05d3-4de3-b3cb-24e88aec1fa1-0
00:27:10.760 --> 00:27:12.440
She's experiencing her own grief.

56859d36-e9b6-4502-8e08-19568145d999-0
00:27:12.440 --> 00:27:15.240
And when she says,
did the move help you get over her?

0ce4fcef-3b65-4bc3-82d1-4dbb00ea5d2d-0
00:27:15.920 --> 00:27:20.916
I just can't imagine that being something
someone who has experienced grief would

0ce4fcef-3b65-4bc3-82d1-4dbb00ea5d2d-1
00:27:20.916 --> 00:27:21.160
say.

79fe2bf9-b574-4895-aed4-b9c6fe520042-0
00:27:21.280 --> 00:27:24.040
You know,
you don't ever get over that person.

b67dbca6-04dd-4966-968f-af7449fdf60a-0
00:27:24.080 --> 00:27:26.400
In my view,
that's not what you're seeking.

684201bd-3d56-4b24-8f04-296dc6969a78-0
00:27:26.400 --> 00:27:30.569
What you're seeking is to move on with
life without them,

684201bd-3d56-4b24-8f04-296dc6969a78-1
00:27:30.569 --> 00:27:36.033
but not to ever kind of forget they
existed or get over them like you might

684201bd-3d56-4b24-8f04-296dc6969a78-2
00:27:36.033 --> 00:27:37.400
an ex, for example.

f3c637d5-6bb5-46c0-850f-dafc211e32a2-0
00:27:37.600 --> 00:27:42.095
So I think there was this kind of
disconnect a little bit for me between

f3c637d5-6bb5-46c0-850f-dafc211e32a2-1
00:27:42.095 --> 00:27:47.083
what I experienced as a as a real sense
of grief and what was being expressed in

f3c637d5-6bb5-46c0-850f-dafc211e32a2-2
00:27:47.083 --> 00:27:50.224
this story as,
as how grief might play out in this

f3c637d5-6bb5-46c0-850f-dafc211e32a2-3
00:27:50.224 --> 00:27:50.840
situation.

e2f865b5-3117-4358-8731-67fa07e43533-0
00:27:50.840 --> 00:27:52.960
So that's me as a reader.

342eda3a-2db7-4d5e-99d8-44733a6d4e46-0
00:27:52.960 --> 00:27:56.560
I can only speak to my own reaction to
what's happening in this story.

23f1511f-12cf-42c5-b4c8-fc9bf74c9ed3-0
00:27:56.560 --> 00:28:01.040
And that's not everybody's reaction,
but I think that's the same thing that I

23f1511f-12cf-42c5-b4c8-fc9bf74c9ed3-1
00:28:01.040 --> 00:28:05.636
was kind of reacting to in that final
moment as well around it washing down the

23f1511f-12cf-42c5-b4c8-fc9bf74c9ed3-2
00:28:05.636 --> 00:28:09.599
drain and just feeling like that's not
really how that feels for me.

5ed87cfe-55fa-44e9-b0be-ba763c476944-0
00:28:09.600 --> 00:28:12.085
And again,
I'm not I'm not talking about a partner

5ed87cfe-55fa-44e9-b0be-ba763c476944-1
00:28:12.085 --> 00:28:14.716
in in my situation,
but it's still that same sense of

5ed87cfe-55fa-44e9-b0be-ba763c476944-2
00:28:14.716 --> 00:28:16.520
carrying grief with you through life.

ca394948-c1a2-42be-9a27-e3c0cc1e0080-0
00:28:16.920 --> 00:28:20.986
We talk a lot about flash fiction of
having character change and character

ca394948-c1a2-42be-9a27-e3c0cc1e0080-1
00:28:20.986 --> 00:28:23.480
development and kind of sticking the
landing.

d724d6a1-3b78-4dc0-ae13-87dff9707a0f-0
00:28:23.760 --> 00:28:27.535
I think there is like a desire to end
your story with like something

d724d6a1-3b78-4dc0-ae13-87dff9707a0f-1
00:28:27.535 --> 00:28:31.092
significant happening,
but maybe when you're dealing with such a

d724d6a1-3b78-4dc0-ae13-87dff9707a0f-2
00:28:31.092 --> 00:28:34.704
complex emotion like grief,
you need to give it a little bit more

d724d6a1-3b78-4dc0-ae13-87dff9707a0f-3
00:28:34.704 --> 00:28:37.440
space and not closing out on a definite
decision.

aad51023-3e0d-4cb6-862d-bd633f41d29e-0
00:28:37.440 --> 00:28:41.320
It can be just a small point of change
rather than a large point of change.

5458ed08-14a3-4124-8999-c26279f5d549-0
00:28:41.680 --> 00:28:45.649
So this is definitely not something you
could fit in 1500 words,

5458ed08-14a3-4124-8999-c26279f5d549-1
00:28:45.649 --> 00:28:50.047
but it would be such a fascinating
character flaw if the main character

5458ed08-14a3-4124-8999-c26279f5d549-2
00:28:50.047 --> 00:28:53.040
score issue is the inability to see that
nuance.

5206b751-8192-46f8-b025-2d64899f8642-0
00:28:53.040 --> 00:28:57.975
And so she's been locked into like rage
and misery for three years,

5206b751-8192-46f8-b025-2d64899f8642-1
00:28:57.975 --> 00:29:02.040
which we get that piece of information
fairly early on.

12e37e6d-87ce-4650-a76e-5e46f808a496-0
00:29:02.280 --> 00:29:06.120
And the reason she's stuck is because she
sees it as all or nothing.

6ceaa963-4c86-41dd-8e2d-02335bbd2edc-0
00:29:06.440 --> 00:29:10.204
Then this moment in the story where she's
like an all my grief washed down the

6ceaa963-4c86-41dd-8e2d-02335bbd2edc-1
00:29:10.204 --> 00:29:13.540
drain would be like that midpoint false
high where she would be like,

6ceaa963-4c86-41dd-8e2d-02335bbd2edc-2
00:29:13.540 --> 00:29:14.160
I feel great.

3b7afe0b-190e-4785-94ce-fd51037747e2-0
00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:18.296
And then she would go home and like,
*** into her pillow and get absolutely

3b7afe0b-190e-4785-94ce-fd51037747e2-1
00:29:18.296 --> 00:29:22.160
hammered and then not be able to look the
guy in the eye the next day.

1024953a-80f0-4364-a571-86f777cccd4b-0
00:29:22.160 --> 00:29:24.120
Like that would be really interesting.

bf72607b-7d0a-4df9-ac5f-885060ea9263-0
00:29:25.520 --> 00:29:26.840
But that's a novel now.

ce6d1cdf-05ac-408a-ac7e-60b701113276-0
00:29:27.080 --> 00:29:29.875
And, you know,
that's not particularly helpful when

ce6d1cdf-05ac-408a-ac7e-60b701113276-1
00:29:29.875 --> 00:29:32.240
we're trying to tell a story in 1500
words.

ac7066a2-9aeb-4da7-ba03-3d73cafb223a-0
00:29:32.240 --> 00:29:35.803
And I have to say,
I think this story was beautiful in 1500

ac7066a2-9aeb-4da7-ba03-3d73cafb223a-1
00:29:35.803 --> 00:29:36.160
words.

27aa1878-2f0e-475c-9c5e-9d974be114a6-0
00:29:36.200 --> 00:29:38.816
Like we,
I think it's telling that we all want

27aa1878-2f0e-475c-9c5e-9d974be114a6-1
00:29:38.816 --> 00:29:41.600
more of it, you know, and,
and that I said, like,

27aa1878-2f0e-475c-9c5e-9d974be114a6-2
00:29:41.600 --> 00:29:43.160
I'd love to read this novel.

450ccff6-a1c5-4900-be84-4ab9189afffc-0
00:29:43.160 --> 00:29:47.924
Like I think that expresses something
about the characters, you know,

450ccff6-a1c5-4900-be84-4ab9189afffc-1
00:29:47.924 --> 00:29:52.280
wanting more is pretty strong praise of a
of a 1500 word story.

4f73a240-4181-41ee-858f-fefcfc20dab2-0
00:29:52.960 --> 00:29:55.880
I want to ask as well, Elise,
just around apologies,

4f73a240-4181-41ee-858f-fefcfc20dab2-1
00:29:55.880 --> 00:29:59.738
but I keep coming back to this idea of
these voyeuristic and explicit

4f73a240-4181-41ee-858f-fefcfc20dab2-2
00:29:59.738 --> 00:30:00.400
communities.

1c386260-4e3c-4500-9776-819c1d8ec1d0-0
00:30:00.800 --> 00:30:02.080
Fascinated by this idea.

7790daa2-f0a2-4bb8-91a9-85dfea4ba1cb-0
00:30:02.960 --> 00:30:05.557
When I think about voyeurism and
exhibitionism,

7790daa2-f0a2-4bb8-91a9-85dfea4ba1cb-1
00:30:05.557 --> 00:30:09.400
normally it's like there is the ******
and there is the exhibitionist.

5bde7dd8-cd1a-43dc-b356-1f049e6cc9b8-0
00:30:09.960 --> 00:30:14.153
In this story there are people,
in fact the main character taking on both

5bde7dd8-cd1a-43dc-b356-1f049e6cc9b8-1
00:30:14.153 --> 00:30:16.760
the role of the ****** and the
exhibitionist.

34d79660-dfac-4787-acea-3bb8f5250ff0-0
00:30:17.400 --> 00:30:20.240
I just wanted to ask,
in your experience how common that is?

3bf1723e-5afc-4d58-8f05-d0ff5850b37d-0
00:30:20.240 --> 00:30:24.868
Is is it more the case where people might
exhibit traits of both or they might be

3bf1723e-5afc-4d58-8f05-d0ff5850b37d-1
00:30:24.868 --> 00:30:26.280
heavily one or the other?

61fe2dc7-b3bc-4d78-b6b2-1fae6d255e6a-0
00:30:26.600 --> 00:30:31.614
I've seen plenty of examples of both and
actually really liked that about this

61fe2dc7-b3bc-4d78-b6b2-1fae6d255e6a-1
00:30:31.614 --> 00:30:36.375
story because the main characters
movement through the process of starting

61fe2dc7-b3bc-4d78-b6b2-1fae6d255e6a-2
00:30:36.375 --> 00:30:41.199
out as solely A ****** and then moving
towards becoming exhibitionist also,

61fe2dc7-b3bc-4d78-b6b2-1fae6d255e6a-3
00:30:41.199 --> 00:30:46.467
that's so complicated and lovely and it's
such a great opportunity to explore what

61fe2dc7-b3bc-4d78-b6b2-1fae6d255e6a-4
00:30:46.467 --> 00:30:48.880
the character's arc really looks like.

8266fa84-0f4f-43b0-9e5b-9de412ee8182-0
00:30:49.200 --> 00:30:53.849
And I also thought that the complexity of
some of those voyeuristic moments,

8266fa84-0f4f-43b0-9e5b-9de412ee8182-1
00:30:53.849 --> 00:30:58.620
there was like a woman with very large
breasts that like is staring at the man

8266fa84-0f4f-43b0-9e5b-9de412ee8182-2
00:30:58.620 --> 00:31:03.390
who's staring at the main character,
who is staring at the woman with the very

8266fa84-0f4f-43b0-9e5b-9de412ee8182-3
00:31:03.390 --> 00:31:07.920
then they're having this moment of all of
them navigating their own stuff.

408bab7f-56ca-4d25-8503-941e1873c0eb-0
00:31:07.920 --> 00:31:11.497
And that's like the thing,
the way the way the line between

408bab7f-56ca-4d25-8503-941e1873c0eb-1
00:31:11.497 --> 00:31:15.969
voyeurism and exhibitionism can often
become kind of blurry is when you're

408bab7f-56ca-4d25-8503-941e1873c0eb-2
00:31:15.969 --> 00:31:20.143
receiving the experience of being
perceived and like even maybe being

408bab7f-56ca-4d25-8503-941e1873c0eb-3
00:31:20.143 --> 00:31:24.913
judged and then kind of getting a thrill
from like knowing that you're breaking

408bab7f-56ca-4d25-8503-941e1873c0eb-4
00:31:24.913 --> 00:31:29.386
norms or expectations or that someone is
wanting you and can't have you or

408bab7f-56ca-4d25-8503-941e1873c0eb-5
00:31:29.386 --> 00:31:33.560
whatever it is that's exciting to you
about that part of the process.

f584d576-176f-49b7-aa05-af5a26ed151b-0
00:31:34.000 --> 00:31:38.277
And then also having that power of
perceiving someone else and knowing that

f584d576-176f-49b7-aa05-af5a26ed151b-1
00:31:38.277 --> 00:31:42.836
they have no control over what's in your
mind and they're aware of that and that

f584d576-176f-49b7-aa05-af5a26ed151b-2
00:31:42.836 --> 00:31:45.200
your gaze is influencing their experience.

f365da3f-2e89-4fbf-b221-a300353575fe-0
00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:49.480
So there are not a tonne of very
straightforward dynamics in kink.

8da802af-1622-4c22-889e-47b455bd56da-0
00:31:49.480 --> 00:31:53.642
There's a lot of this sort of mashing
together of like having power and by

8da802af-1622-4c22-889e-47b455bd56da-1
00:31:53.642 --> 00:31:57.583
having it also losing power,
which I think is one of the things that's

8da802af-1622-4c22-889e-47b455bd56da-2
00:31:57.583 --> 00:31:59.360
so appealing to people about it.

bb1d293c-a5bb-40ec-825a-6d0ee0cbbbee-0
00:31:59.360 --> 00:32:02.746
But certainly there are like,
pure voyeurs and there are pure

bb1d293c-a5bb-40ec-825a-6d0ee0cbbbee-1
00:32:02.746 --> 00:32:04.440
exhibitionists in those pieces.

a62cee40-0b8c-4ec6-9009-abde639b8333-0
00:32:04.800 --> 00:32:08.701
You'll often find yourself in situations
where consent is a little more

a62cee40-0b8c-4ec6-9009-abde639b8333-1
00:32:08.701 --> 00:32:12.873
complicated, though, because, like,
it's pretty common for consent not to be

a62cee40-0b8c-4ec6-9009-abde639b8333-2
00:32:12.873 --> 00:32:15.800
considered by voyeurist or exhibitionist
like scenes.

6d2242dd-e41b-49a8-a909-68652ae5d532-0
00:32:16.120 --> 00:32:17.480
Yeah, It's not a form of consent.

e52fe353-1f73-4265-957f-1b49a4e599b0-0
00:32:17.480 --> 00:32:21.369
And I think when we're reading these
stories, and I saw your comments on this,

e52fe353-1f73-4265-957f-1b49a4e599b0-1
00:32:21.369 --> 00:32:25.406
at least it was the first time I'd really
thought about that voyeuristic consent,

e52fe353-1f73-4265-957f-1b49a4e599b0-2
00:32:25.406 --> 00:32:29.246
just because it's not something that
people are taught and it's not something

e52fe353-1f73-4265-957f-1b49a4e599b0-3
00:32:29.246 --> 00:32:32.347
that people really are forced to consider
in their daily life,

e52fe353-1f73-4265-957f-1b49a4e599b0-4
00:32:32.347 --> 00:32:34.760
like most sexual activities behind closed
doors.

6ca2cd01-5b99-4557-ba02-f1715602d852-0
00:32:34.840 --> 00:32:40.040
And we focus on consent between one
person and another within that activity.

61fe63bb-4dee-479a-b854-40e7c1834094-0
00:32:40.400 --> 00:32:42.752
Yeah,
there's a whole other world outside of

61fe63bb-4dee-479a-b854-40e7c1834094-1
00:32:42.752 --> 00:32:45.157
that,
which we're we're you're coming back to

61fe63bb-4dee-479a-b854-40e7c1834094-2
00:32:45.157 --> 00:32:46.360
that other world again.

6d7c9dc9-41b3-4078-a93c-5865e15e5001-0
00:32:46.640 --> 00:32:48.971
It's like,
where's my invitation is I think the

6d7c9dc9-41b3-4078-a93c-5865e15e5001-1
00:32:48.971 --> 00:32:49.360
subtext.

edbed0a0-8545-46e0-a4fa-3777abd2d224-0
00:32:49.360 --> 00:32:52.360
Where's the wheresthedomain.
com dot AU for that?

2eda3f1b-27b3-4d2b-8372-049852e35356-0
00:32:54.880 --> 00:32:58.120
But I do think that that was navigated
well in this story.

60ef0816-1134-4c75-bdb3-68f7fbdf6705-0
00:32:58.120 --> 00:33:01.312
Like to be very clear,
everybody in this story is clearly happy

60ef0816-1134-4c75-bdb3-68f7fbdf6705-1
00:33:01.312 --> 00:33:02.360
with what's going on.

cfa854b6-4d20-46a4-a982-3a244c498372-0
00:33:02.360 --> 00:33:04.520
So that was not an issue here.

35859788-6e6d-4053-8f86-a6678e9f99a8-0
00:33:04.760 --> 00:33:08.773
That was something I actually really
liked about it because it's sort of like

35859788-6e6d-4053-8f86-a6678e9f99a8-1
00:33:08.773 --> 00:33:12.735
this acknowledged ethos of the community
that you go outside to your outdoor

35859788-6e6d-4053-8f86-a6678e9f99a8-2
00:33:12.735 --> 00:33:16.490
shower when you want to participate in
that like group exhibitionist and

35859788-6e6d-4053-8f86-a6678e9f99a8-3
00:33:16.490 --> 00:33:17.520
voyeurist behaviour.

e111ace4-70ff-4313-9b52-f0411b68c9e1-0
00:33:17.840 --> 00:33:21.422
And there is AI don't know if people who
are not ***** know this,

e111ace4-70ff-4313-9b52-f0411b68c9e1-1
00:33:21.422 --> 00:33:25.494
but there's a thing called Fetlife,
which is essentially like Facebook for

e111ace4-70ff-4313-9b52-f0411b68c9e1-2
00:33:25.494 --> 00:33:26.200
***** people.

95164786-5283-4e7c-a7b2-a0c5832bde75-0
00:33:26.520 --> 00:33:29.420
Most people have a thing up there saying
like, if you're doing a research paper,

95164786-5283-4e7c-a7b2-a0c5832bde75-1
00:33:29.420 --> 00:33:30.280
you're not welcome here.

836ea7ab-4447-432d-9338-9fbd64700e2c-0
00:33:30.640 --> 00:33:33.320
But if you're just curious,
you absolutely are welcome.

7ddc41e3-12e3-49f8-884b-6eed2db2880f-0
00:33:33.320 --> 00:33:37.751
You're welcome to join and you're welcome
to ask questions and people put up

7ddc41e3-12e3-49f8-884b-6eed2db2880f-1
00:33:37.751 --> 00:33:38.960
photographs of stuff.

ec1f5c9c-09ca-4b0a-aeb1-72165fd3206f-0
00:33:38.960 --> 00:33:41.408
And so it like the,
if you want to learn more,

ec1f5c9c-09ca-4b0a-aeb1-72165fd3206f-1
00:33:41.408 --> 00:33:43.440
Fetlife is a great place to to do that.

a9802520-a058-43ab-900a-b6224439f30d-0
00:33:43.960 --> 00:33:44.680
Fascinating.

daf13fd2-77e3-4656-a23b-75499c22d856-0
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:47.280
His fingers are touching right now.

6dc9dece-e0dc-41a1-a938-51e48cbef444-0
00:33:47.280 --> 00:33:48.920
He wants to run over to the computer.

459b5812-8c36-4f0f-a146-5001ba7c9b98-0
00:33:49.120 --> 00:33:51.320
No, for look,
just more curious than anything.

ad426962-3ef1-4953-a187-22dced12db55-0
00:33:51.320 --> 00:33:52.040
It's a whole.

b4f7d2ab-7321-4581-8b28-3d435f1d3a01-0
00:33:52.040 --> 00:33:54.440
It's a world that I haven't been exposed
to, so to speak.

ffda12d3-e80b-4f00-8d32-736a31e1beb5-0
00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:56.280
And hey, the jar.

f65b71c7-be28-4269-a7d1-c5b66528669b-0
00:33:56.280 --> 00:33:56.800
Where's your dog?

4c13f1af-5744-44fd-b61e-5802b4125671-0
00:33:56.840 --> 00:33:58.040
Yeah, I've got a dollar right here.

ce75c849-b6c0-4efc-881c-c77ccdb0d4f0-0
00:34:00.120 --> 00:34:02.000
So at least was there anything else you
wanted to share?

1f2870d1-c429-450d-8b79-7f3f9ee07cad-0
00:34:02.000 --> 00:34:03.600
Any other thoughts about this story?

432ba1ce-5f34-4356-b3da-6927bdf92012-0
00:34:04.000 --> 00:34:08.160
Yeah, so I, I made a lot of critique here,
but I loved this story.

04e68565-7871-4201-a3aa-6c1e43973b91-0
00:34:08.160 --> 00:34:11.440
I think I even did a shout out about it
because I loved it so much.

630fb0fd-b86d-4c61-ae60-91bcc2f9e505-0
00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:15.440
So it's one of those that stuck with me
and I was really excited that there was a

630fb0fd-b86d-4c61-ae60-91bcc2f9e505-1
00:34:15.440 --> 00:34:18.319
bare devil on it,
and then even more excited that I got to

630fb0fd-b86d-4c61-ae60-91bcc2f9e505-2
00:34:18.319 --> 00:34:22.320
come and talk about it because it's full
of all of these really terrific moments.

bba4fe7b-352d-44a3-87ab-61c101783a01-0
00:34:22.320 --> 00:34:27.120
There's a moment where Cooper comes over
and then he just kind of is like,

bba4fe7b-352d-44a3-87ab-61c101783a01-1
00:34:27.120 --> 00:34:31.920
I'm around and then he leaves and she's
like he slips back into the house.

1d66d419-7ce9-437d-899b-4c77fcf00403-0
00:34:31.920 --> 00:34:34.120
Like a man who understands the art of
good timing.

36f4a4c1-977a-4c25-95d1-89dbd3eb7da3-0
00:34:34.120 --> 00:34:37.760
And like the layers of that moment made
me so happy.

8bb49584-c0f7-4857-80af-c3a4566c5c56-0
00:34:39.040 --> 00:34:42.000
The layers of meaning in that were just
beautiful to me.

96f6f6cd-46df-4697-b326-b71510c0c581-0
00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:42.760
So there's tonnes.

6a3c591d-c4aa-48cc-9e5f-c1124f0dfa8b-0
00:34:42.760 --> 00:34:44.080
There's tonnes to love here.

af39943c-71fe-4eb1-8029-edf1ac17cb79-0
00:34:44.080 --> 00:34:46.400
I don't want to be leaving the impression
that I didn't.

ce79334c-ee43-4b23-81ac-28f5b7a7e974-0
00:34:46.560 --> 00:34:49.045
And honestly,
just about everything to do with the kink

ce79334c-ee43-4b23-81ac-28f5b7a7e974-1
00:34:49.045 --> 00:34:49.400
I loved.

d54a58e2-5544-46cd-9b17-f67951beff31-0
00:34:49.600 --> 00:34:52.400
Yeah,
it was definitely a fun and eye opening.

651da515-077c-40e6-8c61-77ef99a459be-0
00:34:52.400 --> 00:34:56.903
We keep saying category to read this
story was there probably weren't a lot of

651da515-077c-40e6-8c61-77ef99a459be-1
00:34:56.903 --> 00:34:59.240
this kind of voyeurism and exhibitionism.

b007dffa-4fec-4747-93fc-0148a0059df1-0
00:34:59.240 --> 00:35:00.960
There were a few, but like not a lot.

54c32c46-1c24-48a7-b462-d38ec3e9534a-0
00:35:01.400 --> 00:35:05.000
And it was probably like the stand out in
that sense.

5cd0a6db-fa04-4e93-8ef8-55a438246011-0
00:35:05.160 --> 00:35:07.864
And yeah,
we're we're excited to publish this story

5cd0a6db-fa04-4e93-8ef8-55a438246011-1
00:35:07.864 --> 00:35:08.280
as well.

86a0fef6-b45a-4b63-a60d-d7ac7f1f323e-0
00:35:08.280 --> 00:35:11.480
So this will be featuring in one of our
flesh fiction volumes.

3bbbd234-8acb-408d-9060-3bba1bcd7afa-0
00:35:11.920 --> 00:35:13.618
Well,
thank you so much for joining us again,

3bbbd234-8acb-408d-9060-3bba1bcd7afa-1
00:35:13.618 --> 00:35:13.840
Elise.

73180552-4727-41ce-a7cc-9950ccdc1969-0
00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:15.760
And no doubt it won't be the last time.

252670d5-ff60-4a1d-b26f-706a01d19680-0
00:35:16.560 --> 00:35:17.320
Always a joy.

5b73d362-4c88-4582-8ef2-e9d58a536c0d-0
00:35:19.040 --> 00:35:20.200
So thanks again, Elise.

2e435efe-3533-4f27-ab87-a81f38a234be-0
00:35:20.200 --> 00:35:21.200
That was a lovely chat.

9a70adc0-f6bd-4e9a-8240-2b7026936e3d-0
00:35:21.200 --> 00:35:25.640
We talked a lot about the themes in that
chat and kind of the emotional experience.

93c11351-9592-48b0-a05f-1c114542ee2e-0
00:35:25.960 --> 00:35:30.141
But I think Jenny's also interested to
know a bit more about the writing as well,

93c11351-9592-48b0-a05f-1c114542ee2e-1
00:35:30.141 --> 00:35:32.640
like the the nuts and bolts of the
storytelling.

2d2d7676-1efb-4138-8f24-60fc74879a1d-0
00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:35.280
And Jenny sent to say voicemail as well.

e200c8ac-f3a1-4f84-b810-a2ec442d7cc7-0
00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:36.440
So we'll play that now.

56e0d3f9-dc49-49d2-a927-494916ed9d41-0
00:35:39.720 --> 00:35:43.174
Hi Amanda and Ed,
it's Jenny E and I'm really excited and

56e0d3f9-dc49-49d2-a927-494916ed9d41-1
00:35:43.174 --> 00:35:45.080
also nervous to be a bare devil.

4f46c5e5-87d3-443b-80e2-826b1fed6a82-0
00:35:45.880 --> 00:35:50.632
This is my first time writing erotica so
I really leaned into my research which

4f46c5e5-87d3-443b-80e2-826b1fed6a82-1
00:35:50.632 --> 00:35:54.434
said that I should have the plot revolve
around the sex scenes,

4f46c5e5-87d3-443b-80e2-826b1fed6a82-2
00:35:54.434 --> 00:35:55.920
not the other way around.

751b22b2-bfeb-44bc-bae1-7288e714dd7c-0
00:35:56.320 --> 00:35:59.873
But in doing that I worry that maybe the
conflict and tension are too subtle,

751b22b2-bfeb-44bc-bae1-7288e714dd7c-1
00:35:59.873 --> 00:36:01.240
so I'd love your take on that.

3bd08acd-42b4-4b3f-84c5-3f5fb10e4008-0
00:36:02.080 --> 00:36:05.900
Another thing I know I struggle with
because my beta readers tell me so,

3bd08acd-42b4-4b3f-84c5-3f5fb10e4008-1
00:36:05.900 --> 00:36:07.680
is that I don't trust my audience.

5ba65f27-3708-46e2-ab3d-87e8f3ce8a65-0
00:36:08.040 --> 00:36:10.668
But I don't really recognise when I'm
over explaining,

5ba65f27-3708-46e2-ab3d-87e8f3ce8a65-1
00:36:10.668 --> 00:36:13.440
so I'd love help spotting where I could
use more subtext.

37991012-5d04-4994-8beb-3b2f890f0a94-0
00:36:14.040 --> 00:36:16.629
And lastly,
I already know I'm going to cringe when

37991012-5d04-4994-8beb-3b2f890f0a94-1
00:36:16.629 --> 00:36:18.920
you read my time stamp scene breaks out
loud.

f26fa726-762d-4b37-8b23-d2414d35b8d7-0
00:36:19.200 --> 00:36:22.720
So any tips on moving time forward in a
last sort of clunky way?

b1a89513-3f96-49f8-ab30-13612aebb460-0
00:36:23.000 --> 00:36:26.840
You know less now it's two days later at
midnight would be amazing.

572c78b0-e104-49b3-9aa7-eadc2847130e-0
00:36:27.200 --> 00:36:29.598
Finally,
just a big thanks for the flash fiction

572c78b0-e104-49b3-9aa7-eadc2847130e-1
00:36:29.598 --> 00:36:30.480
prize opportunity.

11cf57bd-454b-422a-87ac-d2431b5e63c1-0
00:36:30.840 --> 00:36:34.480
Through my writing,
I try to normalise sex for women over 40.

e6331f18-ec25-4f21-b1e3-cafa8a590021-0
00:36:34.800 --> 00:36:36.960
You know,
I do this because too often I feel like

e6331f18-ec25-4f21-b1e3-cafa8a590021-1
00:36:36.960 --> 00:36:39.120
we're overlooked or we're flattened into
the Mrs.

7cc2d76a-f651-421f-b1b0-01c6be4495e3-0
00:36:39.120 --> 00:36:40.000
Robinson trope.

941f0f25-76bd-406e-af2d-882a8a3f2e4d-0
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:44.400
And I want to show that women over 40
like sex and gas.

6b51b1aa-6ee6-4670-8053-e9abf871fc15-0
00:36:44.400 --> 00:36:47.000
Maybe they masturbate,
and that's very normal.

acea8cde-2768-4c98-8e9b-678efe58dca4-0
00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:49.739
And, you know,
they have the right to claim what makes

acea8cde-2768-4c98-8e9b-678efe58dca4-1
00:36:49.739 --> 00:36:51.772
them feel sexy, whatever that means,
you know,

acea8cde-2768-4c98-8e9b-678efe58dca4-2
00:36:51.772 --> 00:36:54.800
without feeling embarrassed or like they
need to give an explanation.

000b14e3-43db-4f5e-a522-cc811ef72b06-0
00:36:54.800 --> 00:36:57.280
And I hope this story accomplishes that.

cc760dc5-becd-4a18-ac51-47898e9357a1-0
00:36:58.080 --> 00:37:01.040
I'll be listening to your podcast with my
girlfriends and a bunch of wine.

1661b45d-c111-461a-ac83-e330a8412f99-0
00:37:01.280 --> 00:37:02.800
So don't feel guilty about roasting me.

959a445e-58cf-4948-a521-d0fcaded2216-0
00:37:02.800 --> 00:37:04.360
I have my girls to support me.

494c99e7-5f19-4f19-9bf4-fc3ce6e2e0c4-0
00:37:04.920 --> 00:37:05.360
Cheers.

785c8063-4dcd-471d-8277-aa42c5a28ece-0
00:37:07.160 --> 00:37:09.329
So thank you, Jenny,
for your questions and some great

785c8063-4dcd-471d-8277-aa42c5a28ece-1
00:37:09.329 --> 00:37:09.960
questions there.

22225653-82fb-4a03-b00f-17fa239663fc-0
00:37:09.960 --> 00:37:13.073
Yeah,
we'll get into some of the specifics as

22225653-82fb-4a03-b00f-17fa239663fc-1
00:37:13.073 --> 00:37:17.473
we go through the story,
but maybe to address some of those more

22225653-82fb-4a03-b00f-17fa239663fc-2
00:37:17.473 --> 00:37:21.467
general questions,
I find the first one fascinating around

22225653-82fb-4a03-b00f-17fa239663fc-3
00:37:21.467 --> 00:37:24.040
do you prioritise the sex or the plot?

f0ef28a5-a35a-47cd-a204-63063d1de425-0
00:37:24.800 --> 00:37:26.200
Do you have thoughts about that, Amanda?

4b7b6455-612b-4eb0-a571-1cf5c2326b90-0
00:37:26.320 --> 00:37:29.029
I do,
and I think my thoughts stem from reading

4b7b6455-612b-4eb0-a571-1cf5c2326b90-1
00:37:29.029 --> 00:37:30.440
so many of these stories.

7ddb9dc6-c886-4049-8c2a-e7e738678dbb-0
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:34.980
And I would say the stories that I guess
rose to the top in this competition are

7ddb9dc6-c886-4049-8c2a-e7e738678dbb-1
00:37:34.980 --> 00:37:38.400
probably ones that prioritise the
storytelling over the sex.

3e7a54b2-b2f2-4ba5-a04a-4a919c248e8f-0
00:37:38.400 --> 00:37:40.594
You know,
there were stories that weren't

3e7a54b2-b2f2-4ba5-a04a-4a919c248e8f-1
00:37:40.594 --> 00:37:41.640
particularly ******.

95cc0c08-d275-49c8-811a-7fbfd0058e8f-0
00:37:41.640 --> 00:37:43.902
If we talk about, you know,
we have mentioned this before,

95cc0c08-d275-49c8-811a-7fbfd0058e8f-1
00:37:43.902 --> 00:37:46.280
like they're not getting you off,
They're not turning you on.

2f67f516-fdb9-481d-8931-21088c6cbe75-0
00:37:46.280 --> 00:37:49.240
They're just great stories involving or
incorporating sex.

1861507d-0cd6-4d63-9b1a-4e1fb440bbf8-0
00:37:49.680 --> 00:37:53.190
But then there were also stories that
were just really hot and,

1861507d-0cd6-4d63-9b1a-4e1fb440bbf8-1
00:37:53.190 --> 00:37:57.414
and we loved them for that reason,
but they still had to be well written and

1861507d-0cd6-4d63-9b1a-4e1fb440bbf8-2
00:37:57.414 --> 00:38:00.760
well constructed for it to rise to the
top in a competition.

bbf134e6-5910-4f17-8371-af493bca215c-0
00:38:00.760 --> 00:38:02.819
Like,
and we're talking about a competition

bbf134e6-5910-4f17-8371-af493bca215c-1
00:38:02.819 --> 00:38:04.925
setting,
not like you're on your own in your

bbf134e6-5910-4f17-8371-af493bca215c-2
00:38:04.925 --> 00:38:07.639
bedroom at home and you just want a story
to get you off.

c46405f7-c456-4bb5-bc67-41ec3b50e6c3-0
00:38:07.640 --> 00:38:09.760
We're talking about a writing competition.

e8a26bee-f9fd-4d22-8cf6-a563dcda38aa-0
00:38:09.760 --> 00:38:12.200
So it's it's kind of like a different
audience.

395f6318-e438-410a-a29c-0bd513c96ee7-0
00:38:12.280 --> 00:38:14.360
So I think there's a few different things
at play there.

46769b60-100a-4066-89cb-0ad4e12350ce-0
00:38:14.360 --> 00:38:16.448
I mean,
I would say I always love storytelling

46769b60-100a-4066-89cb-0ad4e12350ce-1
00:38:16.448 --> 00:38:17.960
and I don't think the two have to.

6dbd84c9-43dc-46e4-91aa-bf2f0dbf4b39-0
00:38:18.400 --> 00:38:20.400
It's not like you have to choose one or
the other.

bdd33be1-631b-4951-ab02-e159d8c6c2c2-0
00:38:20.520 --> 00:38:21.520
I think you can have both.

be2c34c6-3d34-42fa-ac47-cfd736296cca-0
00:38:21.520 --> 00:38:23.840
It's definitely not a A1 or the other
situation.

cad961b6-ca65-4128-9e2e-6a622ee78f07-0
00:38:23.880 --> 00:38:26.160
I think you need both really to make it
work.

a88ed5e6-dec2-48c5-b591-77306c95183a-0
00:38:26.160 --> 00:38:30.046
What I think that Jenny's done really
well here is keep the sex throughout the

a88ed5e6-dec2-48c5-b591-77306c95183a-1
00:38:30.046 --> 00:38:32.408
story,
And I think I may have commented on this

a88ed5e6-dec2-48c5-b591-77306c95183a-2
00:38:32.408 --> 00:38:36.098
in one of our flesh fiction episodes,
is that the stories that were worked

a88ed5e6-dec2-48c5-b591-77306c95183a-3
00:38:36.098 --> 00:38:40.132
especially well for me were the ones that
maintained that voice and that mood all

a88ed5e6-dec2-48c5-b591-77306c95183a-4
00:38:40.132 --> 00:38:40.920
the way through.

49cd4f11-9a8c-456f-b58b-4fbfcabec0d4-0
00:38:41.320 --> 00:38:46.240
Like it wasn't set up sex scene,
Denu mall situation, right?

6a434473-1705-40f3-b209-f24669a73521-0
00:38:46.720 --> 00:38:50.968
You get into it straight into like that
that sexual mindset and it builds and it

6a434473-1705-40f3-b209-f24669a73521-1
00:38:50.968 --> 00:38:53.275
develops,
but you're always kind of in that

6a434473-1705-40f3-b209-f24669a73521-2
00:38:53.275 --> 00:38:53.800
headspace.

e3eefca7-eb04-448a-b8ed-18150a927ebb-0
00:38:54.040 --> 00:38:55.640
This story does that really well.

a34e4b12-faa0-4eef-96d8-a6d2e17e3a9b-0
00:38:55.800 --> 00:38:56.640
Yeah, absolutely.

a55076f1-aac4-4ed4-b9ab-02a6267ea95d-0
00:38:56.640 --> 00:38:58.709
I think this is probably a prime example
of that,

a55076f1-aac4-4ed4-b9ab-02a6267ea95d-1
00:38:58.709 --> 00:39:00.200
where those two things are balanced.

26bc4905-76af-4c2b-823c-3a46acaf351e-0
00:39:00.200 --> 00:39:02.120
And, you know,
you could always have more story.

5536a23a-ffa4-40a0-b5c1-f04038852467-0
00:39:02.120 --> 00:39:03.400
You could always do more on everything.

0c2ed38c-4139-4566-877a-911557d52a8e-0
00:39:03.400 --> 00:39:05.345
And we will get into our critiques of
like,

0c2ed38c-4139-4566-877a-911557d52a8e-1
00:39:05.345 --> 00:39:07.600
what more you could do and the
opportunities here.

e48655cc-130a-4044-b91d-49a49d5a3efa-0
00:39:08.120 --> 00:39:12.416
But I did think there was a really nice
balance of what was sexy and a turn on

e48655cc-130a-4044-b91d-49a49d5a3efa-1
00:39:12.416 --> 00:39:16.712
and then what was like compelling and
emotionally resonant and interesting and

e48655cc-130a-4044-b91d-49a49d5a3efa-2
00:39:16.712 --> 00:39:19.160
engaging,
all those aspects of storytelling.

59ee5b86-6400-4877-a669-56679933ace7-0
00:39:19.160 --> 00:39:20.760
And I think this is a great example.

d4488286-aff1-4578-b7c1-a2c5cb34858b-0
00:39:20.760 --> 00:39:22.406
And I mean,
that's why it's going to be published,

d4488286-aff1-4578-b7c1-a2c5cb34858b-1
00:39:22.406 --> 00:39:22.600
right?

9169bbb7-7f12-4cc7-a78f-90513c0af94c-0
00:39:22.600 --> 00:39:23.720
You're going to publish this one.

acad21e3-ff68-4f80-aee9-13c881d3b80a-0
00:39:23.720 --> 00:39:25.680
And I think it's a beautiful story in
many ways.

8121a235-988a-4710-acb7-38b0420f302f-0
00:39:25.680 --> 00:39:26.760
And it's also really hot.

33f5fd74-b960-41d0-9059-890144a20d90-0
00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:29.200
So really,
I think you ticked both boxes there.

7c9bc88f-f166-4bff-bd85-30a90934a7bb-0
00:39:29.800 --> 00:39:31.080
Ticking both boxes.

5fa26ef9-5f62-4139-a045-1589e48cd762-0
00:39:31.120 --> 00:39:31.560
Wow.

0acf0d7e-2171-439c-8685-19408572cc86-0
00:39:32.600 --> 00:39:34.280
Yes, yeah.

d9827882-a5de-4057-8a3c-31fdcdcc5cec-0
00:39:34.280 --> 00:39:37.674
One thing I'll add as well,
because Jenny mentioned about the

d9827882-a5de-4057-8a3c-31fdcdcc5cec-1
00:39:37.674 --> 00:39:40.248
timestamps,
and I think this is something that

d9827882-a5de-4057-8a3c-31fdcdcc5cec-2
00:39:40.248 --> 00:39:40.960
distracts me.

79c4ebc7-f600-4c71-81d9-9156a5cdd7de-0
00:39:40.960 --> 00:39:45.085
When we talk about flash fiction
competitions, especially 500 words,

79c4ebc7-f600-4c71-81d9-9156a5cdd7de-1
00:39:45.085 --> 00:39:49.449
having kind of split scenes in 500 words,
I feel as a distraction and an

79c4ebc7-f600-4c71-81d9-9156a5cdd7de-2
00:39:49.449 --> 00:39:52.200
opportunity to consolidate and to
streamline.

f9d53aea-f3eb-4f80-8158-347c6f0f9dc8-0
00:39:52.200 --> 00:39:57.200
Often in this story,
I felt that didn't distract me at all.

8cb7c79f-a038-4677-8259-07814f89197a-0
00:39:57.520 --> 00:40:00.136
And I actually really liked that about
this story,

8cb7c79f-a038-4677-8259-07814f89197a-1
00:40:00.136 --> 00:40:03.881
that it had that kind of lingering
quality of just like there's a lot of

8cb7c79f-a038-4677-8259-07814f89197a-2
00:40:03.881 --> 00:40:06.960
space around what was happening,
like it was just snippets.

c1fbf5a1-d345-4272-b28a-514c77a08f61-0
00:40:07.480 --> 00:40:11.922
It also kind of put you in the mood of
this main character obviously living her

c1fbf5a1-d345-4272-b28a-514c77a08f61-1
00:40:11.922 --> 00:40:13.200
life in this community.

4a0c6ca2-2f2c-4854-966f-3bfc3af5d2b0-0
00:40:13.400 --> 00:40:18.361
And this is just like this brief moment
of excitement that happens in the evening,

4a0c6ca2-2f2c-4854-966f-3bfc3af5d2b0-1
00:40:18.361 --> 00:40:18.720
right?

0e9ddb85-a0bb-4eef-a26f-f44de15894a9-0
00:40:18.720 --> 00:40:21.202
And the rest of the time,
she's probably dealing with whatever

0e9ddb85-a0bb-4eef-a26f-f44de15894a9-1
00:40:21.202 --> 00:40:23.960
normal stuff that she has to deal with
and on top of that, her grief.

811cdee8-a3a0-46ee-8fe3-a05f89d203ae-0
00:40:23.960 --> 00:40:27.993
But what we get are those moments of
excitement and knowing that they are so

811cdee8-a3a0-46ee-8fe3-a05f89d203ae-1
00:40:27.993 --> 00:40:31.032
spread apart like 2 days later,
this other little moment,

811cdee8-a3a0-46ee-8fe3-a05f89d203ae-2
00:40:31.032 --> 00:40:34.280
and two days later,
this other little moment, it's like this.

a2dbb0a3-f67e-4920-9dff-0aa9604ac1f7-0
00:40:34.280 --> 00:40:38.120
It's a bit of a tease and I think that
works really well in this context.

4a469fcb-4465-4f82-abaa-a77a6553587d-0
00:40:38.120 --> 00:40:41.166
And I can't think of a better way of
doing that right,

4a469fcb-4465-4f82-abaa-a77a6553587d-1
00:40:41.166 --> 00:40:43.880
apart from just a simple timestamp 2 days
later.

4ad6c06d-f6cb-4901-be13-db8f72515a8b-0
00:40:44.040 --> 00:40:46.080
For me, that was fairly seamless.

7af757e7-3df0-4b8c-b9e5-5e0d713f8e8f-0
00:40:46.080 --> 00:40:48.000
Yeah, I actually wanted to say that too.

c50bbea1-b0e7-49ed-b404-95c5521bf7cc-0
00:40:48.000 --> 00:40:50.880
Like I think like you say,
we talk about just have a single scene.

59a5a5f5-d9d8-485e-a26e-4d02091611b2-0
00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:52.520
I mean, that's in a 500 word story.

27a347b1-e2a3-4d33-85e2-f405806714a7-0
00:40:52.520 --> 00:40:55.880
I wouldn't necessarily say a 1500 word
story needs to be a single scene.

a2e9f74f-a73c-4931-bac8-bedb2d8f322c-0
00:40:55.880 --> 00:40:57.560
You've got all that extra room.

38fb9983-2bd1-4195-a1af-a7a22e2f1572-0
00:40:57.960 --> 00:41:01.880
But I actually thought this is a perfect
example of how to do that well.

33cb4320-7d76-4c1c-a933-3db76bd00b2a-0
00:41:02.280 --> 00:41:05.435
So I don't know if you might be surprised
to hear that, Jenny,

33cb4320-7d76-4c1c-a933-3db76bd00b2a-1
00:41:05.435 --> 00:41:07.640
you've you're sort of saying it was
clunky.

d943631d-ec59-4538-bf4d-18df35c7bedc-0
00:41:07.640 --> 00:41:08.560
I disagree.

e4faad8b-512c-4dca-ab3a-2d8fb47df621-0
00:41:08.560 --> 00:41:10.480
Like, I think you handled it very well.

b2683227-1a4c-477d-8a6e-294a83d68c8a-0
00:41:10.480 --> 00:41:13.743
And and I guess for those who are,
I guess less experienced with it,

b2683227-1a4c-477d-8a6e-294a83d68c8a-1
00:41:13.743 --> 00:41:17.527
maybe one way of thinking about it is if
you were telling your best friend this

b2683227-1a4c-477d-8a6e-294a83d68c8a-2
00:41:17.527 --> 00:41:19.845
story about this hot guy who moved in
next door,

b2683227-1a4c-477d-8a6e-294a83d68c8a-3
00:41:19.845 --> 00:41:22.400
what are you keeping in and what are you
leaving out?

4ab85f2f-f13f-47dc-a99c-2460fc93e97a-0
00:41:22.440 --> 00:41:22.640
Right?

ef97b5dc-c739-4f63-a89d-55bbb2736673-0
00:41:22.640 --> 00:41:24.360
You're just keeping in the highlights.

c4feb214-43e5-4c13-a3fc-11202202c528-0
00:41:24.360 --> 00:41:24.920
You're just saying.

b72abbf3-266b-402f-8ba0-4a7a91565003-0
00:41:24.920 --> 00:41:27.920
And then two nights later he was like,
blah, right?

e525970a-9f14-4377-bab1-14b9d14d5a69-0
00:41:27.920 --> 00:41:29.120
You're not saying in any way.

ecbd57a3-4af6-4dc1-aed7-b3f7c94412bf-0
00:41:29.120 --> 00:41:32.612
I went to the shops and I did my
groceries and time passed and, you know,

ecbd57a3-4af6-4dc1-aed7-b3f7c94412bf-1
00:41:32.612 --> 00:41:33.320
I had to sleep.

ce57c5ea-0062-4707-ae9d-c937a5ee49e3-0
00:41:33.320 --> 00:41:35.833
No,
ditch that and just skip to the to the

ce57c5ea-0062-4707-ae9d-c937a5ee49e3-1
00:41:35.833 --> 00:41:36.360
next bit.

9cd45b60-4889-4a94-a53c-72561786a7c2-0
00:41:36.760 --> 00:41:39.760
And when we're having a conversation,
we don't care.

1906cc20-a6b1-414b-a01a-2be833659904-0
00:41:39.800 --> 00:41:42.400
We're not wondering what happened in
those two days.

e8b089a2-9210-431c-a488-ca9b8b826478-0
00:41:42.400 --> 00:41:42.920
We don't care.

778e7819-5d9b-428f-bd9a-c37a9471a0dd-0
00:41:42.920 --> 00:41:44.200
We're just like, Yep, what next?

8e4db67d-375c-4268-908a-c255564e620e-0
00:41:44.240 --> 00:41:47.565
And I think stories like this that span
these time jumps,

8e4db67d-375c-4268-908a-c255564e620e-1
00:41:47.565 --> 00:41:51.922
much as we might advise against them in a
500 word story, most of the time,

8e4db67d-375c-4268-908a-c255564e620e-2
00:41:51.922 --> 00:41:55.018
not all the time,
but when they do work is when we're

8e4db67d-375c-4268-908a-c255564e620e-3
00:41:55.018 --> 00:41:57.999
keeping this thread of the story that's
being told.

84306b82-3084-4399-8872-867f77b4a6e0-0
00:41:58.000 --> 00:42:00.569
So in this case,
the thread and the theme is this outdoor

84306b82-3084-4399-8872-867f77b4a6e0-1
00:42:00.569 --> 00:42:03.760
shower stuff and this relationship that's
building with this neighbour.

b4b098c1-7708-407f-8bee-4c617313d8c1-0
00:42:04.280 --> 00:42:05.640
We don't need anything else.

92a2f2e5-d2f7-4b7e-8974-a42bf49c3d75-0
00:42:05.920 --> 00:42:08.457
But as you say,
it's important to show that passage of

92a2f2e5-d2f7-4b7e-8974-a42bf49c3d75-1
00:42:08.457 --> 00:42:12.240
time because it wouldn't have that same
emotional resonance if he just turned up.

b0b68603-feda-44f4-92ae-19f2fe49ce39-0
00:42:12.240 --> 00:42:14.560
And it's like, hey, let's **** OK, let's,
let's do it.

e008d93d-8737-4c27-ad90-dd509e8a4a0d-0
00:42:14.560 --> 00:42:18.006
And I think that that was maybe a
shortcoming of some of the other stories

e008d93d-8737-4c27-ad90-dd509e8a4a0d-1
00:42:18.006 --> 00:42:21.040
we talked about where there was no build
up, there was no climax.

45c7d617-555d-44d2-a678-4ac47a5db1a8-0
00:42:21.080 --> 00:42:23.400
Everyone's just into it from the start.

98c6b967-d8e8-4ec6-a8d0-3c18542f4bd8-0
00:42:23.920 --> 00:42:27.468
And while that might be a really great
experience in real life,

98c6b967-d8e8-4ec6-a8d0-3c18542f4bd8-1
00:42:27.468 --> 00:42:29.520
it makes for a less satisfying story.

aa7f0090-880a-47ed-8339-88b7280f4628-0
00:42:29.520 --> 00:42:33.903
And so I think that conflict, the tension,
the him kind of being prepared to walk

aa7f0090-880a-47ed-8339-88b7280f4628-1
00:42:33.903 --> 00:42:38.019
away and come back and wait a couple of
nights and all of that leads to this

aa7f0090-880a-47ed-8339-88b7280f4628-2
00:42:38.019 --> 00:42:41.280
extra punch at the end when she finally
gets what she wants.

21466579-cd08-4f12-bc4a-6876ee87d427-0
00:42:41.320 --> 00:42:41.600
Yeah.

3804d7aa-27da-43c7-9999-6474bc9b17d8-0
00:42:41.640 --> 00:42:46.332
And I think it's a real challenge as well
that Jenny has executed really well is

3804d7aa-27da-43c7-9999-6474bc9b17d8-1
00:42:46.332 --> 00:42:50.620
being able to sit in that emotional
complexity of that character that the

3804d7aa-27da-43c7-9999-6474bc9b17d8-2
00:42:50.620 --> 00:42:55.196
grief they're they're dealing with all of
the inflicting emotions that they're

3804d7aa-27da-43c7-9999-6474bc9b17d8-3
00:42:55.196 --> 00:42:59.136
dealing with in terms of like,
do I want to let go of this previous

3804d7aa-27da-43c7-9999-6474bc9b17d8-4
00:42:59.136 --> 00:42:59.600
partner?

7c1f5a6d-0944-4b9d-a0d4-7576abb75520-0
00:42:59.600 --> 00:43:03.600
Do I want to say yes to this thing that's
coming towards me looming?

342f0d0e-24ab-4620-8fb9-084fb35f6a58-0
00:43:03.720 --> 00:43:04.520
Exactly.

f527b868-e222-4803-84bd-7f1ba4f16602-0
00:43:04.600 --> 00:43:08.771
While keeping it sexy and while keeping
it embedded in that emotion,

f527b868-e222-4803-84bd-7f1ba4f16602-1
00:43:08.771 --> 00:43:12.580
because I think that is important for an
****** story as well,

f527b868-e222-4803-84bd-7f1ba4f16602-2
00:43:12.580 --> 00:43:15.240
is not getting too deep into the sad
stuff.

22c15eea-59dc-4978-8249-13aa68c69b7a-0
00:43:15.480 --> 00:43:16.800
You know, it is possible.

ec6692f9-2512-4196-93c4-fe86348b0346-0
00:43:16.800 --> 00:43:18.000
It does change the tone of the story.

4ad3f750-044a-425e-88d8-d43128c2ea4d-0
00:43:18.000 --> 00:43:22.243
And we did have some category winners
that were very sad and kind of were in

4ad3f750-044a-425e-88d8-d43128c2ea4d-1
00:43:22.243 --> 00:43:22.960
that emotion.

143a40d8-1aad-47b2-9d7f-69fe04ac8865-0
00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:25.958
But I think if you do do want to keep it
a turn on kind of thing,

143a40d8-1aad-47b2-9d7f-69fe04ac8865-1
00:43:25.958 --> 00:43:29.502
then you do want to sit with that emotion
a little bit more than you do those

143a40d8-1aad-47b2-9d7f-69fe04ac8865-2
00:43:29.502 --> 00:43:30.320
negative emotions.

aabdd39c-02c1-4fbe-8059-958339400ee6-0
00:43:30.320 --> 00:43:31.720
Yeah, no, I agree.

6c818cdc-e788-40c9-8394-8c9a49068af5-0
00:43:31.720 --> 00:43:33.884
And you know,
you can have that push and pull and

6c818cdc-e788-40c9-8394-8c9a49068af5-1
00:43:33.884 --> 00:43:35.400
that's where the conflict comes in.

6cc5025d-eafd-4448-9d8c-5c5f0a232d1b-0
00:43:35.920 --> 00:43:38.800
But we don't want it to be the overriding
feeling.

ccdd63df-4602-409c-a7e5-353b4e3bac0f-0
00:43:38.800 --> 00:43:42.729
We don't want readers to be sad as
they're reading about this steamy shower

ccdd63df-4602-409c-a7e5-353b4e3bac0f-1
00:43:42.729 --> 00:43:43.040
scene.

93e1e899-cbc6-4187-bc74-12587dda0c08-0
00:43:43.040 --> 00:43:47.080
We want readers to feel that relief that
she's feeling and that kind of like

93e1e899-cbc6-4187-bc74-12587dda0c08-1
00:43:47.080 --> 00:43:48.760
letting go and, and all of that.

5d9c1df7-0ba3-48f7-9725-02acc684ab80-0
00:43:48.760 --> 00:43:50.320
That's the emotion that we're going for.

8e585c94-e81d-4afa-b7a9-618ff9f154ae-0
00:43:50.320 --> 00:43:52.440
And I think that's what this story does
build towards.

f7df9dcd-eb9d-4b2b-9ad1-34bd3d35ea6c-0
00:43:52.440 --> 00:43:53.320
We've got that tension.

3a9ecd28-f532-4d38-9f41-ea1fb6bc0446-0
00:43:53.320 --> 00:43:57.120
We've got that feeling of her being
constrained, as Elise pointed out as well.

c8a81187-c23c-448a-8cf8-20f7e38400b1-0
00:43:57.520 --> 00:44:00.240
And then we build to this point where she
lets it go.

aa825303-8e1f-499e-8e24-443a73915cf5-0
00:44:00.400 --> 00:44:01.920
And that's the whole point of this story.

96460006-1fb4-4038-8f68-4aae389278f4-0
00:44:01.920 --> 00:44:04.508
And I think that was a powerful aspect of
this story,

96460006-1fb4-4038-8f68-4aae389278f4-1
00:44:04.508 --> 00:44:07.960
that emotional release on top of what was
also just a really hot scene.

8fa35be4-105d-4b33-9124-0c24a82c482f-0
00:44:08.040 --> 00:44:10.301
Yeah,
I think it's a really compelling premise

8fa35be4-105d-4b33-9124-0c24a82c482f-1
00:44:10.301 --> 00:44:12.708
as well,
because as I've mentioned several times,

8fa35be4-105d-4b33-9124-0c24a82c482f-2
00:44:12.708 --> 00:44:15.740
I think in the discussion with Lisa and
earlier, as a premise,

8fa35be4-105d-4b33-9124-0c24a82c482f-3
00:44:15.740 --> 00:44:17.280
I found this really interesting.

f8c5533a-279e-4345-aa90-8bacfd81f0b8-0
00:44:17.280 --> 00:44:21.233
And then on top of that,
you've layered an actual character,

f8c5533a-279e-4345-aa90-8bacfd81f0b8-1
00:44:21.233 --> 00:44:24.280
actual conflict and all of that kind of
thing.

d6e7f13d-287b-46b3-96a1-94fefd254e33-0
00:44:24.280 --> 00:44:26.520
So all of those things are really working
for you there.

2a7ad1df-ac07-4599-bb69-54d3f968aaa0-0
00:44:27.320 --> 00:44:30.961
So before we get into a little bit more
detail about the story,

2a7ad1df-ac07-4599-bb69-54d3f968aaa0-1
00:44:30.961 --> 00:44:34.716
just to address the theme response here
and the theme, of course,

2a7ad1df-ac07-4599-bb69-54d3f968aaa0-2
00:44:34.716 --> 00:44:36.480
making the unsexy irresistible.

b6d5dee0-44d0-4635-b6e1-e5f2d5a8fe8d-0
00:44:36.640 --> 00:44:40.960
So I guess the unsexy thing in this story
was probably grief.

f1928fbc-565f-4a80-b5f4-22943021ee89-0
00:44:41.320 --> 00:44:44.960
It's interesting that you say that, okay,
because we had to guess.

4c69d2c8-2d6d-47ec-8092-5971712f2755-0
00:44:45.680 --> 00:44:49.000
Jenny didn't put an explanation in the
brief explanation field.

292445c5-33f5-45b1-a30a-7668b7587ff2-0
00:44:49.000 --> 00:44:53.405
And so Elise had guessed like you had,
that it was the grief over the death of a

292445c5-33f5-45b1-a30a-7668b7587ff2-1
00:44:53.405 --> 00:44:55.200
spouse that was the unsexy thing.

a59f40eb-03a1-46ca-b6e2-302aa33e6b35-0
00:44:55.520 --> 00:44:58.080
I came in later and I was like,
I'm not sure if that's it.

92819267-3829-4072-8efe-588e1cc8d455-0
00:44:58.080 --> 00:45:01.989
Maybe it's this home owners association
thing because I know that's a big,

92819267-3829-4072-8efe-588e1cc8d455-1
00:45:01.989 --> 00:45:05.430
it's not here in Australia,
but we're very familiar with the home

92819267-3829-4072-8efe-588e1cc8d455-2
00:45:05.430 --> 00:45:07.880
owners association issues that you might
have.

4e4bc2c9-8d0f-4a2b-97d3-4d6ce39cc0d9-0
00:45:07.880 --> 00:45:11.520
We have strata issues here in Australia
and very similar.

7926e585-aa73-4019-b27a-d3bd87f6835d-0
00:45:12.320 --> 00:45:13.560
But yeah, like we were guessing.

5431a1fd-c87f-49cc-a587-16b99ec68636-0
00:45:13.560 --> 00:45:16.926
And in fact, Jenny clarified subsequently,
you know,

5431a1fd-c87f-49cc-a587-16b99ec68636-1
00:45:16.926 --> 00:45:21.689
once all everything was revealed,
that in fact her inspiration was that it

5431a1fd-c87f-49cc-a587-16b99ec68636-2
00:45:21.689 --> 00:45:22.960
was outdoor showers.

5a506f24-9256-4109-b053-3faf9578e37b-0
00:45:23.120 --> 00:45:23.480
Ohh, really?

f1f2a0e3-833f-4771-9a53-8b4e5f0abab4-0
00:45:23.480 --> 00:45:24.680
That were the unsexy thing.

9af5b83f-5dd1-48c7-b7b1-97eb3fb17cb7-0
00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:29.267
And look, speaking as an Australian,
I'm not sure I find outdoor showers

9af5b83f-5dd1-48c7-b7b1-97eb3fb17cb7-1
00:45:29.267 --> 00:45:29.680
unsexy.

13a41e4f-183d-4586-ba81-fee12835f650-0
00:45:29.960 --> 00:45:31.040
Do you think it's a climate thing?

94e62468-61d8-4773-afec-7c4e975078b8-0
00:45:31.240 --> 00:45:32.520
Maybe it's a climate thing.

b18d457d-af5a-4432-b48f-1a2d1359f47f-0
00:45:32.520 --> 00:45:33.920
It's like they're quite worse.

686d3d26-8fe1-4e57-b7d0-7b387951f97a-0
00:45:34.080 --> 00:45:37.260
On my honeymoon I went to Thailand where
they have outdoor showers and I have a

686d3d26-8fe1-4e57-b7d0-7b387951f97a-1
00:45:37.260 --> 00:45:39.805
pretty sexy place anyway,
and there was this whole community of

686d3d26-8fe1-4e57-b7d0-7b387951f97a-2
00:45:39.805 --> 00:45:40.680
outdoor showers there.

bc86442f-62e4-4526-a0a1-c108e62dcd41-0
00:45:40.680 --> 00:45:42.160
It was really fascinating.

e7d46b4c-1516-4701-a1b8-cb23fc0ce88d-0
00:45:42.480 --> 00:45:45.221
But yeah,
I don't know that I would call an outdoor

e7d46b4c-1516-4701-a1b8-cb23fc0ce88d-1
00:45:45.221 --> 00:45:48.280
shower particularly unsexy where we live
in on the coast.

44cf9d05-8be2-4aeb-a747-0d703ff27ef9-0
00:45:48.600 --> 00:45:50.734
Yeah,
they're a thing that you have you rinse

44cf9d05-8be2-4aeb-a747-0d703ff27ef9-1
00:45:50.734 --> 00:45:54.030
off after the beach and yeah,
I'm not like looking out the window with

44cf9d05-8be2-4aeb-a747-0d703ff27ef9-2
00:45:54.030 --> 00:45:54.680
my binoculars.

3c98aef3-ffef-47d6-a5b5-9dda8541d602-0
00:45:54.760 --> 00:45:55.600
Yeah, them.

64e3b374-3d06-4c0b-84bd-002fa553320c-0
00:45:55.600 --> 00:45:56.480
But it's.

e0f6d8cd-3ff8-4a7a-aa75-cf9fb846dcb2-0
00:45:56.560 --> 00:45:58.652
Yeah,
it's interesting that Jenny would be

e0f6d8cd-3ff8-4a7a-aa75-cf9fb846dcb2-1
00:45:58.652 --> 00:45:59.480
inspired by that.

77d80647-acfc-491f-aed6-beae1292458e-0
00:45:59.600 --> 00:45:59.960
Yeah.

ee47e2d7-7cfc-4416-a656-df933b62bdae-0
00:45:59.960 --> 00:46:04.576
Look, I, I'm agnostic to that, but there,
you know, there's a couple of odd things,

ee47e2d7-7cfc-4416-a656-df933b62bdae-1
00:46:04.576 --> 00:46:07.600
as you mentioned,
the HOA also in title and the grief.

159f587e-8b56-4027-a359-6f1d4c8288ef-0
00:46:07.600 --> 00:46:10.680
So certainly there were things in here
that are unsexy.

ca0df021-863f-47f6-b851-94ec59391d7a-0
00:46:10.680 --> 00:46:13.400
Whatever your thoughts are about outdoor
showers.

b4fe904e-6a2b-4b29-a863-fe50c39e3641-0
00:46:13.800 --> 00:46:17.240
So the title of the story is Voyeurism
and Exhibitionism.

f90673d8-8398-434c-b860-dfecadc1e6e3-0
00:46:17.440 --> 00:46:18.440
HOA approved.

e3a60cec-8ac3-4b6e-b91b-de667dd302bf-0
00:46:18.480 --> 00:46:19.200
Do you have any thoughts?

af22112f-fe3e-4397-a751-640f066bf940-0
00:46:19.520 --> 00:46:19.840
I do.

83556de4-4e8a-4812-bf43-0db43d62004e-0
00:46:19.840 --> 00:46:23.652
I would say a tick in the pro column is
that it was very memorable,

83556de4-4e8a-4812-bf43-0db43d62004e-1
00:46:23.652 --> 00:46:26.120
the voyeurism and exhibitionism core
theme.

c221c749-8aa4-46ae-8d3f-9f16c7a61e35-0
00:46:26.400 --> 00:46:29.720
So to have that in the titles, like Yep,
I remember that story straight away.

21c56ed0-365e-41e5-ad9e-5d24d517200a-0
00:46:30.200 --> 00:46:33.800
I would say the challenge for me is that
the tone isn't right.

321a26f9-118e-4724-b9cf-b357c973d136-0
00:46:33.840 --> 00:46:37.829
I feel like it's a little comedic,
almost like this whole HOA thing,

321a26f9-118e-4724-b9cf-b357c973d136-1
00:46:37.829 --> 00:46:40.200
like we know that that's ripe with drama.

252b796f-c5ee-41c5-b699-5d4206ad35c6-0
00:46:40.440 --> 00:46:43.680
And I'm not sure that that tone is where
the story went.

1cbde3d9-d45b-4a32-b491-9f3546405a5d-0
00:46:43.960 --> 00:46:45.680
And so I would challenge the title.

95dd8bd1-41c9-4750-80eb-9669785f8fbc-0
00:46:45.680 --> 00:46:48.387
I would say I think although it was
memorable,

95dd8bd1-41c9-4750-80eb-9669785f8fbc-1
00:46:48.387 --> 00:46:51.960
it doesn't emotionally or tonally fit the
story that follows.

6f26d8e6-e39a-4f6f-bba6-c6d3cfdb5d01-0
00:46:52.320 --> 00:46:55.089
But nevertheless,
it was memorable and and allowed us to,

6f26d8e6-e39a-4f6f-bba6-c6d3cfdb5d01-1
00:46:55.089 --> 00:46:58.480
I guess, recall the story in our minds,
which is a a big tick, really.

edd83078-bde3-42f7-82cf-fdb3377563a6-0
00:46:58.880 --> 00:47:00.200
All right, so let's move on to the story.

e02cbe60-1eb3-412c-8d4a-248512d13114-0
00:47:00.520 --> 00:47:03.645
Look, with these bare devils,
we're not going to go through line by

e02cbe60-1eb3-412c-8d4a-248512d13114-1
00:47:03.645 --> 00:47:07.321
line because there are many more lines
than what we normally have, but we will,

e02cbe60-1eb3-412c-8d4a-248512d13114-2
00:47:07.321 --> 00:47:09.160
I guess, maybe call out some highlights.

87b232f8-d7d1-4cc3-ae55-d09a734e5743-0
00:47:09.760 --> 00:47:11.320
So we want to talk about the opening.

06192153-23b3-41b7-918c-6637f6e0f56b-0
00:47:11.560 --> 00:47:16.073
So the opening line,
unmistakable moans and the rhythmic

06192153-23b3-41b7-918c-6637f6e0f56b-1
00:47:16.073 --> 00:47:19.320
splashing of water on skin fills the air.

1df79a79-4004-4620-a912-a14c6990d1ab-0
00:47:19.680 --> 00:47:22.680
From my second floor balcony,
I lean into the darkness.

5fd2caa3-7912-4fc8-bd59-19b5fecc5842-0
00:47:22.800 --> 00:47:27.440
I scanning neighbouring backyards,
searching for the source of pleasure

5fd2caa3-7912-4fc8-bd59-19b5fecc5842-1
00:47:27.440 --> 00:47:29.760
spilling shamelessly into the night.

84fc5063-a14d-42e3-a904-598837a73cc1-0
00:47:30.040 --> 00:47:34.280
I do love the idea of that pleasure
spilling shamelessly into the night.

1406bb01-0528-4ad8-8029-be4af88fcee3-0
00:47:34.280 --> 00:47:35.440
It's a great image.

5f78f80d-35e5-4279-bced-7a6726346fa7-0
00:47:35.520 --> 00:47:38.220
I think that the opening paragraphs
together,

5f78f80d-35e5-4279-bced-7a6726346fa7-1
00:47:38.220 --> 00:47:41.920
all of them do a great job of putting us
right in the context.

c81fce23-611e-4d8c-9d41-cf6a05a018b4-0
00:47:41.920 --> 00:47:44.760
Like we talk about dropping into the
scene as the story begins.

ce7c4fbf-2522-4340-9fe3-d2f57a35456c-0
00:47:44.760 --> 00:47:46.400
And I think this story does that very
well.

e4968608-aa7b-4e53-9bbe-604ea075be01-0
00:47:46.400 --> 00:47:48.440
It's clear we know what we're looking at.

e38df327-9133-4472-99e9-7e860f19879d-0
00:47:48.760 --> 00:47:52.225
And it sets the tone as well,
the sexy tone that continues throughout

e38df327-9133-4472-99e9-7e860f19879d-1
00:47:52.225 --> 00:47:52.720
the story.

2969edbc-1571-4e1c-a193-007561ef9d60-0
00:47:52.800 --> 00:47:54.640
Yeah,
We're not caught up in back story here.

9cb37837-f359-417a-bb8d-d52ecac9aa11-0
00:47:54.640 --> 00:47:56.160
We're right in the moment, which is great.

e0bda197-833c-4089-8a6a-7223d08d435d-0
00:47:56.920 --> 00:48:00.670
And another thing worth pointing out is
also this, the sensory experience there,

e0bda197-833c-4089-8a6a-7223d08d435d-1
00:48:00.670 --> 00:48:03.680
like we're talking about sounds,
we're talking about the sights.

7d5150ee-3f90-4070-8b37-dac91bb61183-0
00:48:03.960 --> 00:48:08.258
And you get that sense almost of the time
and even the season, like I,

7d5150ee-3f90-4070-8b37-dac91bb61183-1
00:48:08.258 --> 00:48:11.649
I was sort of in there in the season as
well with this,

7d5150ee-3f90-4070-8b37-dac91bb61183-2
00:48:11.649 --> 00:48:16.371
even though it's not actually mentioned,
just this idea of seaside, you know,

7d5150ee-3f90-4070-8b37-dac91bb61183-3
00:48:16.371 --> 00:48:19.519
we kind of got that cool summer evening
vibe to it.

945dbf03-5961-4a33-83ea-cde0416a2846-0
00:48:19.520 --> 00:48:22.520
And also this idea of wetness as well,
which is all the way through.

e380ab57-68bc-4b70-85fd-c2ae8ea05853-0
00:48:22.520 --> 00:48:26.263
We're in showers,
we're showering every night and that's

e380ab57-68bc-4b70-85fd-c2ae8ea05853-1
00:48:26.263 --> 00:48:26.920
the focus.

ad50d990-7996-4526-b1ce-5d2adfbcf9bc-0
00:48:26.920 --> 00:48:31.080
So straight away in the first line,
like we're wet basically,

ad50d990-7996-4526-b1ce-5d2adfbcf9bc-1
00:48:31.080 --> 00:48:32.960
to put it one way, Let's go.

3be71015-f47f-4c1e-994c-7bbdcfde700c-0
00:48:33.360 --> 00:48:35.656
So yeah,
I would say it's actually a great set up

3be71015-f47f-4c1e-994c-7bbdcfde700c-1
00:48:35.656 --> 00:48:37.080
and a little bit voicy as well.

75196faa-8f1a-4322-8e26-7593d638d448-0
00:48:37.080 --> 00:48:39.680
We're starting to get this characters of
voice in there, which I like.

187a6419-fd96-44c0-9f6d-68cb9f5ba1fd-0
00:48:40.200 --> 00:48:44.040
One challenge I would say is maybe, and,
and this is probably something I would

187a6419-fd96-44c0-9f6d-68cb9f5ba1fd-1
00:48:44.040 --> 00:48:47.496
say throughout the story is that I think
some of these sentences could,

187a6419-fd96-44c0-9f6d-68cb9f5ba1fd-2
00:48:47.496 --> 00:48:49.320
could have been finessed a little bit.

8b15e45c-6dac-433e-925b-98883932198f-0
00:48:49.360 --> 00:48:51.760
So as an overarching comment, it's great.

ca372578-7bf6-445f-8ea2-2d32ee6aa270-0
00:48:51.760 --> 00:48:52.800
We're heading in the right direction.

1768e5f5-c6da-4502-b27d-e66ae125e2e9-0
00:48:52.800 --> 00:48:54.160
We're getting sensory detail.

c14a5d0d-ebc6-45de-9d2a-f35cc4004c8e-0
00:48:54.160 --> 00:48:55.720
It's clear we know what's happening.

1347aea4-3e65-4342-bf63-4a7b82e13b6c-0
00:48:56.120 --> 00:48:59.964
But some of the sentences,
the the cadence of them or just some of

1347aea4-3e65-4342-bf63-4a7b82e13b6c-1
00:48:59.964 --> 00:49:04.440
the word choices didn't quite land in as
satisfying a way as they might have.

d8ca6099-de72-4f57-a867-d920348d87c2-0
00:49:05.080 --> 00:49:06.960
And I'll use the first line as an example.

68ee2330-c654-4301-b9bc-a9987bdb7d79-0
00:49:06.960 --> 00:49:11.041
So we've got unmistakable moans and the
rhythmic splashing of water on skin fills

68ee2330-c654-4301-b9bc-a9987bdb7d79-1
00:49:11.041 --> 00:49:11.440
the air.

b530c405-333f-4e1f-89bd-1623348db3df-0
00:49:11.880 --> 00:49:14.520
Now we've got fills,
but it's actually plural items.

1c5c8662-8fb2-4c94-a964-0713980c6cc8-0
00:49:14.520 --> 00:49:18.663
So it should really be unmistakable moans
and the rhythmic splash splashing of

1c5c8662-8fb2-4c94-a964-0713980c6cc8-1
00:49:18.663 --> 00:49:20.080
water on skin fill the air.

f4c4bdba-2817-4d01-8c73-6e2dcc27f312-0
00:49:20.560 --> 00:49:24.280
And I know I'm that's a tiny little thing,
but it's also your first sentence.

74ddd8a2-c5a1-471b-b0ee-8adfdb19bc16-0
00:49:24.720 --> 00:49:28.866
And so I do think some of that finesse in
terms of like word choice and just

74ddd8a2-c5a1-471b-b0ee-8adfdb19bc16-1
00:49:28.866 --> 00:49:32.096
getting it right,
getting right down to the exact word that

74ddd8a2-c5a1-471b-b0ee-8adfdb19bc16-2
00:49:32.096 --> 00:49:33.119
you're looking for.

e57418b7-cf85-4303-a0e6-c7225263afad-0
00:49:33.120 --> 00:49:37.296
And I think some of these sentences are
either maybe a little bit over long or

e57418b7-cf85-4303-a0e6-c7225263afad-1
00:49:37.296 --> 00:49:41.155
sort of the words could have been
reorganised to just create that smooth

e57418b7-cf85-4303-a0e6-c7225263afad-2
00:49:41.155 --> 00:49:42.160
reading experience.

0ee7fdb2-b908-45b4-aa39-9c596b32b8f9-0
00:49:42.160 --> 00:49:45.120
I think you want to avoid tripping
readers up at any point.

56127f69-7d61-488b-b233-a6c700d6e37d-0
00:49:45.600 --> 00:49:46.720
I don't want to belabour that.

b1bcd00d-6672-47cb-82f3-0003522cc339-0
00:49:46.720 --> 00:49:49.823
I think that's something,
if you read it out loud to yourself,

b1bcd00d-6672-47cb-82f3-0003522cc339-1
00:49:49.823 --> 00:49:53.370
you could pick up things that just didn't
quite ring right in your ear,

b1bcd00d-6672-47cb-82f3-0003522cc339-2
00:49:53.370 --> 00:49:57.360
or if you share it with friends who are
good at picking up on the little detail.

5c5f0e5d-c7e0-4c23-bf92-4718d509d0f9-0
00:49:57.360 --> 00:49:59.160
But I'm talking little detail here.

086f4bf8-d924-4e09-a8db-0802fec93c31-0
00:49:59.160 --> 00:50:02.266
Not like big issues,
just kind of like that final little

086f4bf8-d924-4e09-a8db-0802fec93c31-1
00:50:02.266 --> 00:50:04.120
Polish that would go on the story.

d3c981ab-9efc-4a6e-ac7e-812d0f36efc5-0
00:50:04.320 --> 00:50:06.280
Are you like me when you write these
stories?

401b8423-77c0-4611-9bb3-3f7e5c2497e2-0
00:50:06.280 --> 00:50:10.517
Because I remember when I was revising my
flesh fiction story,

401b8423-77c0-4611-9bb3-3f7e5c2497e2-1
00:50:10.517 --> 00:50:15.897
I would read these paragraphs over and
over and over and over and over and over

401b8423-77c0-4611-9bb3-3f7e5c2497e2-2
00:50:15.897 --> 00:50:20.000
and over so many times and tweak word
after word after word.

7a45281e-2434-489f-ba1d-7b0e453a83fe-0
00:50:20.320 --> 00:50:25.579
And I'm never sure if like, am I,
am I fixing it or am I sucking all of the

7a45281e-2434-489f-ba1d-7b0e453a83fe-1
00:50:25.579 --> 00:50:27.240
energy out of the story?

81f3ea9d-0cb5-40ae-a61b-91dd40327393-0
00:50:27.240 --> 00:50:30.840
I think that's a common problem for
people who get stuck into editing.

88fda40b-992e-4b5b-bfff-2e3966a0ecdb-0
00:50:30.840 --> 00:50:32.040
You can go too far.

1dd659de-11f6-4581-828d-6b9d142d7753-0
00:50:32.120 --> 00:50:33.600
You absolutely can go too far.

4d4db6ab-4ffe-4590-9800-79436014f7bd-0
00:50:33.600 --> 00:50:36.300
And as the author,
you don't know when it's too far because

4d4db6ab-4ffe-4590-9800-79436014f7bd-1
00:50:36.300 --> 00:50:38.280
you've still got the old tone in your
head.

e4f09d99-71ac-4c99-9296-ce5d1923e7e7-0
00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:40.640
You're not coming at it for the first
time missing all of that.

e1bb002f-12aa-4ffd-aa98-5e01f9e44fdf-0
00:50:40.640 --> 00:50:44.393
It's all still lingering,
so I think the only answer to that is a

e1bb002f-12aa-4ffd-aa98-5e01f9e44fdf-1
00:50:44.393 --> 00:50:45.360
good beta reader.

eec3982f-fd31-4f48-94c9-b2a80e16d1e6-0
00:50:45.680 --> 00:50:48.265
If you've got someone who can pick up
that **** for you,

eec3982f-fd31-4f48-94c9-b2a80e16d1e6-1
00:50:48.265 --> 00:50:51.440
that is so valuable because it's almost
impossible to do it yourself.

8b28e235-0dda-4829-8218-3e07350f9de0-0
00:50:51.440 --> 00:50:55.080
I will say reading it out loud to
yourself is one way to pick it up.

f5d42566-3f1a-4ac1-9981-7020aa81b79b-0
00:50:55.480 --> 00:50:59.201
Another way to pick up little details if
you've looked at a story way too many

f5d42566-3f1a-4ac1-9981-7020aa81b79b-1
00:50:59.201 --> 00:51:00.520
times is to change the font.

48aa4981-8980-439d-9db9-edf186809ffc-0
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:03.735
Change the font, it makes sense,
like your brain picks it up for the first

48aa4981-8980-439d-9db9-edf186809ffc-1
00:51:03.735 --> 00:51:03.920
time.

6f306b0c-6f3f-43f5-9a77-b1df45d55dda-0
00:51:03.920 --> 00:51:06.800
So that's a good way to pick up errors if
you're just working solo.

342b7618-40a8-4d6d-979b-f0b6e5aa508a-0
00:51:07.160 --> 00:51:10.640
Just to give another couple of examples
about that finessing thing here.

208283f6-8546-4c9d-9dcc-2e570e7433c0-0
00:51:10.720 --> 00:51:12.440
So we have a couple of paragraphs down.

98896e6f-1af7-42e1-8bb6-39ac6944c83a-0
00:51:12.880 --> 00:51:17.414
Small patches of grass are typically only
occupied by mud filled outdoor showers,

98896e6f-1af7-42e1-8bb6-39ac6944c83a-1
00:51:17.414 --> 00:51:21.948
built less for modesty and more for the
desire not to trek sand into luxury beach

98896e6f-1af7-42e1-8bb6-39ac6944c83a-2
00:51:21.948 --> 00:51:22.279
homes.

24a4fe45-5a20-4db8-93f5-5793e4abf155-0
00:51:22.440 --> 00:51:24.709
Now to me,
all the sentiment there is great,

24a4fe45-5a20-4db8-93f5-5793e4abf155-1
00:51:24.709 --> 00:51:28.340
but it's a bit of a mouthful of a
sentence and when you're reading that

24a4fe45-5a20-4db8-93f5-5793e4abf155-2
00:51:28.340 --> 00:51:30.559
it's just sort of a lot to take in at
once.

8297c3ac-c305-4cc8-970f-283f8c35885f-0
00:51:30.960 --> 00:51:36.200
A good rule of thumb is to sort of top
out at about 25 words in a sentence.

c325cfc6-021b-40be-96c8-c464deac40f9-0
00:51:36.200 --> 00:51:39.920
And that's not like a a rule,
you can absolutely do more than that.

e2540334-dbf6-4110-a846-1877b3c2408d-0
00:51:40.160 --> 00:51:43.406
But in terms of clarity and flow for the
reader,

e2540334-dbf6-4110-a846-1877b3c2408d-1
00:51:43.406 --> 00:51:46.720
these longer sentences can sometimes trip
you up.

7938c455-d3e2-4ae7-8567-39e4e8ac581f-0
00:51:46.840 --> 00:51:50.200
And I think at all times you want people
to just be flowing with the reading.

708a4290-3544-4638-97e1-63ec99b8446a-0
00:51:50.200 --> 00:51:54.350
So that was a sentence I thought could
have maybe been maybe split up or just

708a4290-3544-4638-97e1-63ec99b8446a-1
00:51:54.350 --> 00:51:56.320
reorganised so that the words flowed.

5405fe38-5578-4c69-8583-70fc5c3267c1-0
00:51:57.000 --> 00:52:00.120
And then the following paragraph has
another really long sentence.

a35a8451-6c99-4dc0-bc07-527c8f9a5828-0
00:52:00.120 --> 00:52:00.760
So we have.

da5c970b-9f59-4eec-a5d3-f480e31bbfb5-0
00:52:00.760 --> 00:52:03.570
But this summer,
without any obvious coordination,

da5c970b-9f59-4eec-a5d3-f480e31bbfb5-1
00:52:03.570 --> 00:52:06.490
just after midnight,
all visible from my back porch,

da5c970b-9f59-4eec-a5d3-f480e31bbfb5-2
00:52:06.490 --> 00:52:10.292
a not so secret community of
exhibitionists uses their showers for a

da5c970b-9f59-4eec-a5d3-f480e31bbfb5-3
00:52:10.292 --> 00:52:13.818
very different purpose,
each one hoping neighbours are watching

da5c970b-9f59-4eec-a5d3-f480e31bbfb5-4
00:52:13.818 --> 00:52:14.480
and wanting.

150964c4-fb64-4b71-87e2-523505cc0fa6-0
00:52:15.040 --> 00:52:17.060
Now,
when you read that for the first time,

150964c4-fb64-4b71-87e2-523505cc0fa6-1
00:52:17.060 --> 00:52:20.000
your brain's ready to finish that
sentence a little bit sooner.

122139a5-cb50-45d2-b26e-cbe7b68e8aea-0
00:52:20.080 --> 00:52:24.463
It's just a little bit tricky for people
to embrace all of that on the first read

122139a5-cb50-45d2-b26e-cbe7b68e8aea-1
00:52:24.463 --> 00:52:26.120
again and just say break it up.

1ca8238b-a8c9-4506-8270-2b67b505c61f-0
00:52:26.280 --> 00:52:28.484
Yeah, look,
I don't necessarily have a problem with

1ca8238b-a8c9-4506-8270-2b67b505c61f-1
00:52:28.484 --> 00:52:29.120
long sentences.

d5a68143-6b51-4c84-8819-431ce8cdafd7-0
00:52:29.480 --> 00:52:31.480
It's a question of readability, really,
isn't it?

826ba033-40af-4ba4-9c4c-0e1704fc3d74-0
00:52:31.480 --> 00:52:35.448
Like they do take a little bit of
concentration to kind of tease apart and

826ba033-40af-4ba4-9c4c-0e1704fc3d74-1
00:52:35.448 --> 00:52:38.305
sometimes the order in which the items
are presented,

826ba033-40af-4ba4-9c4c-0e1704fc3d74-2
00:52:38.305 --> 00:52:40.897
like we're talking about small patches of
grass,

826ba033-40af-4ba4-9c4c-0e1704fc3d74-3
00:52:40.897 --> 00:52:43.120
and then we kind of move into other ideas.

1d2695ba-2aa7-46c6-a5ca-d9efd0e5785a-0
00:52:43.480 --> 00:52:47.518
So it's just where you're taking the
reader and where you're making a reader

1d2695ba-2aa7-46c6-a5ca-d9efd0e5785a-1
00:52:47.518 --> 00:52:49.040
look at every moment in time.

05ccd24f-0e22-4b7b-a44c-06d6861b947e-0
00:52:49.160 --> 00:52:51.606
I don't necessarily think it's a major
issue though,

05ccd24f-0e22-4b7b-a44c-06d6861b947e-1
00:52:51.606 --> 00:52:54.560
because it's also part of voice and part
of the tone for story.

a72a5868-26a9-4bd6-a9f1-ac7e5bef7825-0
00:52:54.560 --> 00:52:58.640
So you can definitely use longer
sentences to achieve a certain style.

692db1f7-49a1-4c4a-8a1d-5ea259bfaa5f-0
00:52:58.640 --> 00:52:59.680
I totally agree.

13157063-058b-4b3a-8bb2-7d15cfc46900-0
00:52:59.680 --> 00:53:02.480
You absolutely need to be able to make
stylistic choices like that.

bf1050ed-0ab8-418d-9d20-347521ff8aab-0
00:53:02.480 --> 00:53:07.252
I'm just not sure in this case that
that's a stylistic choice that's adding

bf1050ed-0ab8-418d-9d20-347521ff8aab-1
00:53:07.252 --> 00:53:08.320
value in my mind.

f6a3cdaf-01ae-4b6c-8499-01ca1b685537-0
00:53:08.720 --> 00:53:10.760
You're saying give that extra character
voice, voice.

8b91a487-d90b-42ae-837b-62ad0ae63467-0
00:53:10.760 --> 00:53:12.800
I'm not sure these sentences are doing
that.

f3d05cee-9c69-4c72-bce1-4415faba6469-0
00:53:13.000 --> 00:53:14.600
I don't think they're contributing to
voice.

99153938-2c31-4014-a74f-5c73a5929f43-0
00:53:14.600 --> 00:53:17.440
I think they are potentially tripping a
reader up.

1e64a8bc-bed4-43c8-b481-a55ae090d26e-0
00:53:17.440 --> 00:53:20.120
But look, again, you said it's not a,
it's not a big thing.

42a96a08-6e3d-4662-9def-bd495941c110-0
00:53:20.120 --> 00:53:21.520
It's not, I'm talking finesse.

2adbd216-aa23-4c90-ab5b-c9a05a60e09d-0
00:53:21.520 --> 00:53:22.680
I'm talking final Polish.

b3bd7d94-45f8-437e-8b04-9af51a8cb625-0
00:53:22.680 --> 00:53:25.824
So these things aren't things that would
make me say, oh,

b3bd7d94-45f8-437e-8b04-9af51a8cb625-1
00:53:25.824 --> 00:53:29.945
I don't like this story by any means,
but it might be something that stands

b3bd7d94-45f8-437e-8b04-9af51a8cb625-2
00:53:29.945 --> 00:53:31.680
between you and that next level.

a4c332f2-1eef-41ed-9149-3590bc91bd35-0
00:53:31.800 --> 00:53:33.944
You know,
we're talking high level like that this

a4c332f2-1eef-41ed-9149-3590bc91bd35-1
00:53:33.944 --> 00:53:35.360
story was cut from the long list.

5cd23ad6-d12d-4763-aae4-630202dc6cb0-0
00:53:35.400 --> 00:53:37.691
Like,
maybe it is little things like that that

5cd23ad6-d12d-4763-aae4-630202dc6cb0-1
00:53:37.691 --> 00:53:38.520
stand in the way.

3c503b4d-1667-4a9e-9a64-7813b47a75b1-0
00:53:38.560 --> 00:53:38.840
Yeah.

a3b1cf38-137e-4e83-bd2e-ccde2a044bd6-0
00:53:38.840 --> 00:53:42.374
But what I do love about this opening
sequence is it does feel quite efficient,

a3b1cf38-137e-4e83-bd2e-ccde2a044bd6-1
00:53:42.374 --> 00:53:42.640
right?

18aaf669-4407-4a99-b16c-eccb8247d28d-0
00:53:42.640 --> 00:53:45.015
If we if we look through paragraph by
paragraph,

18aaf669-4407-4a99-b16c-eccb8247d28d-1
00:53:45.015 --> 00:53:47.440
each paragraph does have a clear express
purpose.

712bc741-4dfa-4fab-8c2a-919c10f12a48-0
00:53:47.440 --> 00:53:50.080
There's no,
there's not much fluff in terms of what's

712bc741-4dfa-4fab-8c2a-919c10f12a48-1
00:53:50.080 --> 00:53:50.960
being stated here.

c0330931-0e87-4370-a23f-184af67bfcdd-0
00:53:50.960 --> 00:53:54.334
Where setting the scene,
we're introducing our main character,

c0330931-0e87-4370-a23f-184af67bfcdd-1
00:53:54.334 --> 00:53:58.726
we're giving a little bit of back story
and I do like in that second paragraph we

c0330931-0e87-4370-a23f-184af67bfcdd-2
00:53:58.726 --> 00:54:00.440
get straight into the voyeurism.

2f6fef27-5d4c-4394-839f-ddc024ebc309-0
00:54:00.440 --> 00:54:02.360
What does that mean for the character?

4162bfb7-aa0c-4338-8d3c-03d5569302c5-0
00:54:02.360 --> 00:54:06.071
And straight away I think in those words
that's I'm not proud of my regular

4162bfb7-aa0c-4338-8d3c-03d5569302c5-1
00:54:06.071 --> 00:54:06.560
voyeurism.

ae859b0e-1f99-4199-b455-4f5f7c6d007e-0
00:54:06.560 --> 00:54:07.760
I'm not embarrassed either.

0e5bc3b4-eae1-4d72-a87e-474f8d3bcb82-0
00:54:07.760 --> 00:54:09.600
Shame requires the energy of caring.

890063ac-b044-4747-b25a-0d9b75bca202-0
00:54:09.920 --> 00:54:13.880
We find out about her very quickly and
then we move on, right.

07f91ffe-b0ea-4cbb-9b6f-569879587427-0
00:54:13.880 --> 00:54:17.280
But the little bit we find out about her
is the most important information.

19bab84f-62fe-4a7f-b19e-3f55a6363ddc-0
00:54:17.280 --> 00:54:21.768
The fact that, like,
she's a relatively young widow,

19bab84f-62fe-4a7f-b19e-3f55a6363ddc-1
00:54:21.768 --> 00:54:25.240
she feels like she's too fragile to ****.

dc744165-e37e-4240-8b50-ee3236c0b7ef-0
00:54:25.280 --> 00:54:28.419
And, you know,
and I think that's all we really need to

dc744165-e37e-4240-8b50-ee3236c0b7ef-1
00:54:28.419 --> 00:54:31.840
kind of put ourselves in her mind for the
rest of the story.

5c27a9f7-1539-4f08-96ec-fd22e02c6f07-0
00:54:31.840 --> 00:54:32.560
Absolutely.

2263448a-267e-405e-98f2-a8adcde4f836-0
00:54:32.560 --> 00:54:34.120
I think it's a great bit of setup.

93124793-fb8f-4532-be14-015a3d0ac273-0
00:54:34.320 --> 00:54:37.400
And also we get very shortly after this
is five paragraphs in.

d128e4bf-940f-445b-84de-3a2b3f2cd00a-0
00:54:37.400 --> 00:54:38.760
Well, hello, new neighbour.

5751ea31-9d5c-4f65-9cd4-37b6a498db31-0
00:54:38.760 --> 00:54:42.139
And that's the moment that we really kind
of introduce what is the plot element

5751ea31-9d5c-4f65-9cd4-37b6a498db31-1
00:54:42.139 --> 00:54:44.040
that will play out in the rest of the
story.

6cf10db1-76bb-40eb-a037-4d196b760de8-0
00:54:44.040 --> 00:54:45.600
That's the dramatic question, right?

3d72fbf4-c095-4d23-b5c1-1a7854c33b23-0
00:54:45.600 --> 00:54:46.720
Like, yeah, ****.

b2b9913a-01a2-4c33-8097-44fe4a39d5cc-0
00:54:48.800 --> 00:54:49.560
And that's great.

3c403b3a-105a-4c26-8d24-a23dbc90f786-0
00:54:49.560 --> 00:54:52.989
Like getting that up front there,
you could possibly tighten some of that

3c403b3a-105a-4c26-8d24-a23dbc90f786-1
00:54:52.989 --> 00:54:53.360
opening.

1bc9ef06-117f-4b24-a074-96e3cbb36be8-0
00:54:53.360 --> 00:54:56.320
I think it's, if you will, how tight.

61102963-54c7-439a-8019-45d5f4671ad9-0
00:54:58.480 --> 00:54:59.800
But you know, it's pretty good.

800ec2ab-300a-4f3c-a9fb-732d4fca61c1-0
00:54:59.800 --> 00:55:01.040
It's doing its job there.

0ee6a240-654f-4f02-bb11-9350d247553c-0
00:55:01.040 --> 00:55:03.960
It's all on the first page in the version
we've printed here.

348e8f64-9772-42c9-9089-5ddb06ade6fd-0
00:55:04.080 --> 00:55:04.760
It's all happening.

ad0f80dd-483b-4978-96e2-0ecac8825b42-0
00:55:04.760 --> 00:55:05.680
So I think that's great.

6df62c2d-8f43-4ee8-a2b6-820944cb036a-0
00:55:06.280 --> 00:55:10.029
Jenny raised a point in her earlier
questions which was around her beta

6df62c2d-8f43-4ee8-a2b6-820944cb036a-1
00:55:10.029 --> 00:55:13.986
readers giving her some feedback to say
maybe she's not trusting her reader

6df62c2d-8f43-4ee8-a2b6-820944cb036a-2
00:55:13.986 --> 00:55:17.840
enough and maybe being a little bit too
explicit with some of this stuff.

32451913-9d32-4f18-b2e6-5cdbcdc8493f-0
00:55:17.840 --> 00:55:21.932
Not explicit in a sexy sense,
but explicit in a over explaining sense

32451913-9d32-4f18-b2e6-5cdbcdc8493f-1
00:55:21.932 --> 00:55:22.400
perhaps.

021f78cf-cc23-46a4-95f9-233c4d3757cc-0
00:55:22.760 --> 00:55:26.618
And I guess in response to that,
I just wanted to raise this sentence here,

021f78cf-cc23-46a4-95f9-233c4d3757cc-1
00:55:26.618 --> 00:55:30.781
which is the ocean breeze parts my white
silk robe exposing my unkempt pubic hair

021f78cf-cc23-46a4-95f9-233c4d3757cc-2
00:55:30.781 --> 00:55:34.639
that hasn't seen a man up close since
Jacob's boating accident 3 years ago.

6eaf3446-e3b7-4946-93d0-33aca563af55-0
00:55:35.200 --> 00:55:37.499
And again,
that's another sentence I would say

6eaf3446-e3b7-4946-93d0-33aca563af55-1
00:55:37.499 --> 00:55:40.680
that's maybe quite a bit and might need a
little bit of finesse.

ea134a74-581c-48e6-8826-627f35fb7be5-0
00:55:40.680 --> 00:55:43.069
But also if we're looking at at an
editing point,

ea134a74-581c-48e6-8826-627f35fb7be5-1
00:55:43.069 --> 00:55:46.080
I don't know that we need to mention
Jacob's boating accident.

aac3a809-f243-4ac3-a61c-cec70de9308f-0
00:55:46.080 --> 00:55:49.916
It feels like a bit of a non sequitur,
even though it's highly relevant,

aac3a809-f243-4ac3-a61c-cec70de9308f-1
00:55:49.916 --> 00:55:53.806
It's also not it's not really relevant
how no died and we already know we

aac3a809-f243-4ac3-a61c-cec70de9308f-2
00:55:53.806 --> 00:55:55.120
already know he has died.

45eafe26-f807-4dce-af50-1b9f5dd98dc5-0
00:55:55.640 --> 00:55:59.640
And so I feel like that extra detail kind
of took me out of that a little bit.

835fda0b-76b8-4a05-9769-e452b2e7e502-0
00:56:00.080 --> 00:56:03.840
I don't mind the detail of the it's more
than it's more than moment.

a9e90ec6-e37b-4a98-86d9-4043ca430bb8-0
00:56:03.880 --> 00:56:08.268
I think the point of this paragraph is to
emphasise that it's been a while for our

a9e90ec6-e37b-4a98-86d9-4043ca430bb8-1
00:56:08.268 --> 00:56:09.960
protagonist here, which it does.

c6f6ecaa-e934-4c12-bc59-eaf971624240-0
00:56:10.280 --> 00:56:12.849
But if we're taking it from a first
person perspective,

c6f6ecaa-e934-4c12-bc59-eaf971624240-1
00:56:12.849 --> 00:56:16.291
that's not necessarily the thought
process that I would imagine that she's

c6f6ecaa-e934-4c12-bc59-eaf971624240-2
00:56:16.291 --> 00:56:19.228
going through, you know,
opening her robe because she's feeling

c6f6ecaa-e934-4c12-bc59-eaf971624240-3
00:56:19.228 --> 00:56:22.899
turned on and then touching her pubic
hair and then being remembering about the

c6f6ecaa-e934-4c12-bc59-eaf971624240-4
00:56:22.899 --> 00:56:23.680
boating accident.

59f80efa-05d4-4bf9-b148-eae6ca6bd42c-0
00:56:23.680 --> 00:56:26.077
Look,
it's possible and I think to some extent,

59f80efa-05d4-4bf9-b148-eae6ca6bd42c-1
00:56:26.077 --> 00:56:29.074
and like you are,
we are playing into that conflict here of

59f80efa-05d4-4bf9-b148-eae6ca6bd42c-2
00:56:29.074 --> 00:56:32.520
what she's thinking about,
what she wants versus what she's stuck in

59f80efa-05d4-4bf9-b148-eae6ca6bd42c-3
00:56:32.520 --> 00:56:33.120
emotionally.

c6c5280d-a43f-44cc-8900-f682ef2dbcf7-0
00:56:33.400 --> 00:56:36.870
But just from a reading perspective,
I would say it's just a, like I said,

c6c5280d-a43f-44cc-8900-f682ef2dbcf7-1
00:56:36.870 --> 00:56:40.480
a little bit of a non sequitur and it
kind of just a didn't feel comfortable.

8314c8be-4e7a-4352-81c4-658ea2430ae3-0
00:56:40.480 --> 00:56:44.676
And I would say all you need to change it
to is hasn't seen a man up close since

8314c8be-4e7a-4352-81c4-658ea2430ae3-1
00:56:44.676 --> 00:56:45.920
Jacob and that's enough.

1fccb14a-fed0-4a62-a7da-0a655278dde7-0
00:56:45.920 --> 00:56:48.969
And look,
we're talking about minor details here,

1fccb14a-fed0-4a62-a7da-0a655278dde7-1
00:56:48.969 --> 00:56:52.080
but Jenny did ask about am I trusting my
audience?

644a1d3d-8c4c-431d-9233-17be45facf2c-0
00:56:52.080 --> 00:56:53.080
Not trusting my audience.

b72fd436-3cd7-49ba-aa4c-bfc2fb00112f-0
00:56:53.080 --> 00:56:55.440
And I think maybe that was a little bit
too much spoon feeding.

ad4b4a4e-f41e-4b0c-88f4-42344de35631-0
00:56:55.440 --> 00:56:57.080
We don't need that information.

8824ede3-488e-4558-9efa-96827f8b9a53-0
00:56:57.520 --> 00:57:00.955
And look, in this opening,
I think it's OK to be more direct in the

8824ede3-488e-4558-9efa-96827f8b9a53-1
00:57:00.955 --> 00:57:01.360
opening.

80a8226e-1f64-45bb-89ce-77d4f6b20977-0
00:57:01.360 --> 00:57:02.880
And sometimes I would encourage it.

cbbe9c1f-ca05-4faf-9dfe-a939427e5a96-0
00:57:02.880 --> 00:57:05.680
We talk a lot about don't leave the
mystery.

3d8807dc-5405-4b18-b304-51d2a778823b-0
00:57:05.680 --> 00:57:07.680
You know,
we don't want a mystery in a story.

3263ffde-0930-48b4-bc75-8344f3ae34ea-0
00:57:07.680 --> 00:57:10.480
We need to be able to connect with the
characters right up front.

2755b6e7-e35a-49b7-a3a8-76832ede51ef-0
00:57:10.480 --> 00:57:10.640
Yeah.

0fce2b00-ace9-431a-a48e-2e5ab89d835a-0
00:57:10.720 --> 00:57:13.480
Not, never a mystery,
but not a mystery about what's happening.

2f8296c7-4c3f-4944-9029-77a3556f6931-0
00:57:14.080 --> 00:57:15.160
It's very clear what's happening.

c78f3343-c05e-4000-9242-39aa83fd4aff-0
00:57:15.160 --> 00:57:18.360
And I think that's appropriate for this
stage of the story.

f902600f-949a-404c-a0f3-3012b57917b5-0
00:57:18.840 --> 00:57:23.028
But I did think that there were sometimes
where there was a bit of telling going on

f902600f-949a-404c-a0f3-3012b57917b5-1
00:57:23.028 --> 00:57:26.320
in the story that could have been
replaced by more dramatisation.

61518955-c679-42a3-8100-f5b59f745770-0
00:57:26.320 --> 00:57:27.800
So we'll talk about those as well.

e8d4c247-58b7-4952-9439-9e7081bb42c0-0
00:57:28.120 --> 00:57:31.560
But that was just one example early on,
I guess that that stood out to me.

a7385195-d6cb-4ec5-9ed3-e48b08bdd7b4-0
00:57:32.200 --> 00:57:34.652
Another sort of overarching point I
wanted to make,

a7385195-d6cb-4ec5-9ed3-e48b08bdd7b4-1
00:57:34.652 --> 00:57:38.426
and this is something that's been coming
up for me as I've been editing some of

a7385195-d6cb-4ec5-9ed3-e48b08bdd7b4-2
00:57:38.426 --> 00:57:40.595
the stories for our collection,
is this idea,

a7385195-d6cb-4ec5-9ed3-e48b08bdd7b4-3
00:57:40.595 --> 00:57:43.520
and we've talked about it before,
of never naming an emotion.

f04d1923-f892-42e9-a2e2-070916586c66-0
00:57:43.520 --> 00:57:46.400
So that's a that's a subset of show don't
tell, I guess.

96c78f64-2ffe-4d19-982d-3e3380ff0486-0
00:57:46.880 --> 00:57:50.586
And I think there were sometimes
throughout the story where perhaps the

96c78f64-2ffe-4d19-982d-3e3380ff0486-1
00:57:50.586 --> 00:57:53.160
emotions were just stated instead of
being shown.

dfbb4071-0912-4c53-a3da-07898245bbee-0
00:57:53.560 --> 00:57:55.640
I'll just throw a couple of examples out
there.

e39606c4-773f-4941-bbab-9f59302b70f8-0
00:57:55.640 --> 00:57:59.421
We've got a man presses a woman against
the shower wall and kisses her with a

e39606c4-773f-4941-bbab-9f59302b70f8-1
00:57:59.421 --> 00:58:00.440
desperate tenderness.

bc37015f-4682-4fc1-b45c-b2921f028383-0
00:58:01.080 --> 00:58:03.395
I don't necessarily think that's a
problem,

bc37015f-4682-4fc1-b45c-b2921f028383-1
00:58:03.395 --> 00:58:06.080
but I guess the gold standard is show us
the kiss.

b4cbce6f-8a66-40f1-8add-29a746955fc9-0
00:58:06.680 --> 00:58:10.120
What does he do that is desperate and
tender at the same time?

175fc03c-3e14-4ddd-88ff-cb517f0e5163-0
00:58:10.320 --> 00:58:14.781
Describe the kiss without telling us that
the conclusion that we're supposed to

175fc03c-3e14-4ddd-88ff-cb517f0e5163-1
00:58:14.781 --> 00:58:16.120
reach about that action.

1b429ff7-0875-4918-b16c-9349c6e51c9d-0
00:58:16.520 --> 00:58:19.840
Another example, Half mortified,
half delighted.

fd42f2a0-c45c-45bb-a5b7-b6c0d90eb56d-0
00:58:19.840 --> 00:58:21.800
I say you are very forward.

a5f0ac6c-9728-43eb-b42d-504a005b2dcb-0
00:58:22.280 --> 00:58:24.840
I would potentially suggest replacing
that with an action beat.

a4338646-a751-482b-bdd5-0b41e2e04c1e-0
00:58:24.840 --> 00:58:26.200
What's she doing in that moment?

88a6d5d0-b793-4391-8517-1b2f2ccb5ce6-0
00:58:26.200 --> 00:58:28.040
She's half mortified, half delighted.

87b8f782-2a2e-4998-84e0-57f548e5de25-0
00:58:28.040 --> 00:58:31.520
What's her body language or what action
is she taking in that moment?

b3b66057-2ac7-4563-a136-8dfa501003a8-0
00:58:31.920 --> 00:58:32.480
We've got?

76ea2cc7-2159-4a77-abfa-b838a9b437f6-0
00:58:32.480 --> 00:58:34.760
I sit down, clambering for comfort.

00f9362b-6a70-4e32-9b6f-a47883bceb4c-0
00:58:35.320 --> 00:58:36.280
What does that look like?

1a7535e5-05ca-42a3-a68e-dc7b5c1da89f-0
00:58:36.280 --> 00:58:37.360
How is she sitting down?

ee64c03a-649f-41e2-b385-033488838160-0
00:58:37.360 --> 00:58:38.800
Is she gripping the armrest?

431d5285-e35b-4aa2-9dfa-0df4af0d26e4-0
00:58:38.800 --> 00:58:43.253
You know, and this might be, Jenny,
those opportunities where your beta

431d5285-e35b-4aa2-9dfa-0df4af0d26e4-1
00:58:43.253 --> 00:58:45.480
readers are saying trust the reader.

2da72405-776b-4a8e-a525-bcf09998d639-0
00:58:45.480 --> 00:58:49.868
It's like trust the reader to know that
when she grips the armrest of her chair

2da72405-776b-4a8e-a525-bcf09998d639-1
00:58:49.868 --> 00:58:54.146
and lowers herself down that what she's
doing is searching for comfort there,

2da72405-776b-4a8e-a525-bcf09998d639-2
00:58:54.146 --> 00:58:54.640
you know?

16fc4f7c-a89d-42ca-b9e7-6c34c6ea0e22-0
00:58:54.640 --> 00:58:56.240
And I think it bears repeating.

409f2a2e-e24c-4fb3-b119-3ce892501333-0
00:58:56.240 --> 00:58:58.080
We do talk about this rule quite often.

c2f208b5-3776-4cb5-9239-85d97677a729-0
00:58:58.080 --> 00:58:59.360
Don't name an emotion.

192c3682-a85e-4649-953b-0c9f104c5b95-0
00:58:59.360 --> 00:59:03.280
And sometimes these rules can feel
arbitrary, but they're not.

0a3ee81b-e53b-4320-bb75-ce20225240e4-0
00:59:03.320 --> 00:59:07.542
And they're grounded in, I guess,
psychology because when we as people

0a3ee81b-e53b-4320-bb75-ce20225240e4-1
00:59:07.542 --> 00:59:11.169
observe other people,
we can see what they're feeling in the

0a3ee81b-e53b-4320-bb75-ce20225240e4-2
00:59:11.169 --> 00:59:12.240
way that they act.

1ba28a34-a3bd-4b7c-8187-5856782c4abc-0
00:59:12.240 --> 00:59:13.640
We can see when someone's nervous.

f443e507-ba29-4918-b4d0-0e883c81e143-0
00:59:13.640 --> 00:59:15.400
We can see when someone's angry.

f7dbce19-321c-4b31-8dec-f0d3bfb2d0b2-0
00:59:15.840 --> 00:59:20.056
That's just like a intuition that we
build up over years of interacting with

f7dbce19-321c-4b31-8dec-f0d3bfb2d0b2-1
00:59:20.056 --> 00:59:20.440
people.

4b10e758-0b0a-4825-a35e-d6b6adf7fe67-0
00:59:20.840 --> 00:59:25.061
And so when we read that in a story and
we we hear about how a character is

4b10e758-0b0a-4825-a35e-d6b6adf7fe67-1
00:59:25.061 --> 00:59:27.727
behaving,
we naturally want to put those things

4b10e758-0b0a-4825-a35e-d6b6adf7fe67-2
00:59:27.727 --> 00:59:31.560
together and come to our own conclusions
about what that might mean.

80df5b0b-a0b5-4502-abba-7dc3fbf04061-0
00:59:31.960 --> 00:59:36.793
And when we're told what they're feeling,
it can kind of feel like something's been

80df5b0b-a0b5-4502-abba-7dc3fbf04061-1
00:59:36.793 --> 00:59:38.520
taken away from us as readers.

a59ecd00-5432-4b6c-bda6-4eb4c5e6ad31-0
00:59:39.040 --> 00:59:41.685
And you know,
that intuition doesn't come naturally for

a59ecd00-5432-4b6c-bda6-4eb4c5e6ad31-1
00:59:41.685 --> 00:59:44.000
everyone,
but I think that's something always to

a59ecd00-5432-4b6c-bda6-4eb4c5e6ad31-2
00:59:44.000 --> 00:59:44.520
strive for.

8d593d1a-9dce-4fcc-aa6c-cc7d615e40ee-0
00:59:44.520 --> 00:59:47.950
I think in your first draught,
when you go back and you look,

8d593d1a-9dce-4fcc-aa6c-cc7d615e40ee-1
00:59:47.950 --> 00:59:51.712
any time I've named an emotion,
it's an opportunity to give us body

8d593d1a-9dce-4fcc-aa6c-cc7d615e40ee-2
00:59:51.712 --> 00:59:53.760
language, dialogue or action instead.

263cae25-e2e9-4c07-8529-dd99c0b54600-0
00:59:54.080 --> 00:59:55.920
And it's not always necessary.

957eac45-412b-4d18-9749-0ae4e0a39633-0
00:59:55.920 --> 00:59:57.921
You know,
there'll be times when it's enough to

957eac45-412b-4d18-9749-0ae4e0a39633-1
00:59:57.921 --> 00:59:59.840
just say what the feeling was and we move
on.

56fe1f1e-0eee-4250-ade8-bd418fa1accc-0
00:59:59.840 --> 01:00:01.880
And because we it's not important.

61a61a4c-8fa7-4e24-9c8e-f581c79f1729-0
01:00:02.000 --> 01:00:05.677
Enough emotion for us to fully dramatise
out and we just want to skip over it and

61a61a4c-8fa7-4e24-9c8e-f581c79f1729-1
01:00:05.677 --> 01:00:06.440
sort of be clear.

921fa847-abc4-4bf8-b0d6-051d6869c9a0-0
01:00:06.880 --> 01:00:10.178
But there's other times and there's
certainly times in a piece of ******

921fa847-abc4-4bf8-b0d6-051d6869c9a0-1
01:00:10.178 --> 01:00:13.477
fiction where it's the action,
dialogue and body language that should be

921fa847-abc4-4bf8-b0d6-051d6869c9a0-2
01:00:13.477 --> 01:00:15.240
doing the talking and not the narrator.

9ba1cb38-6ab6-470e-b75f-d53c6d5cb788-0
01:00:15.400 --> 01:00:17.160
So just an opportunity there.

262168dd-f36d-4394-a871-0f1679ae4ab3-0
01:00:17.160 --> 01:00:20.640
I didn't find it to be particularly
distracting in the story, I have to say.

f6bb2ceb-4671-4615-9987-6ed79383d8dc-0
01:00:20.960 --> 01:00:24.398
But going over it with a fine tooth comb
with an editor's mindset,

f6bb2ceb-4671-4615-9987-6ed79383d8dc-1
01:00:24.398 --> 01:00:26.656
I would be saying opportunity,
opportunity,

f6bb2ceb-4671-4615-9987-6ed79383d8dc-2
01:00:26.656 --> 01:00:29.120
opportunity to just level that up a
little bit.

8e130e68-114c-42e2-a60e-f1a4e51c38c2-0
01:00:29.520 --> 01:00:32.351
And similarly,
I think sometimes when we summarise

8e130e68-114c-42e2-a60e-f1a4e51c38c2-1
01:00:32.351 --> 01:00:34.961
action,
we can miss that opportunity to really

8e130e68-114c-42e2-a60e-f1a4e51c38c2-2
01:00:34.961 --> 01:00:36.960
give the reader the picture as well.

ae5f6316-ab11-43fa-b341-cac506841d8a-0
01:00:36.960 --> 01:00:38.960
And again, look, we can't show everything.

30f9e9a8-f3b2-4a0e-8ad8-439405ffccf1-0
01:00:38.960 --> 01:00:41.680
I will never leave, you know,
we'll run out of words pretty quick.

90517895-6164-4320-84e8-207989b552eb-0
01:00:42.040 --> 01:00:44.658
But an example is the moment where he
shrugs and says,

90517895-6164-4320-84e8-207989b552eb-1
01:00:44.658 --> 01:00:46.800
it's only fair considering you looked
first.

065c984f-babe-4ef9-856c-949d57b03aef-0
01:00:47.240 --> 01:00:48.920
That's a pretty full on moment.

b768bccf-edd8-4b38-bc1b-1e81db7113cd-0
01:00:49.320 --> 01:00:51.000
And it just says I nearly choke.

7368fbb9-143d-45e9-afa1-d32107c78ce6-0
01:00:51.160 --> 01:00:52.000
And now that's fine.

00471ec0-a599-4631-b636-f804c575d9c6-0
01:00:52.120 --> 01:00:53.560
That's a summary of the action.

d42c63d2-3b60-4e90-b3bf-641e44ce0db9-0
01:00:53.560 --> 01:00:56.880
But what you could also do is show that
moment where she nearly chokes.

b1de36f6-e22d-4d10-94ee-28d142dc266a-0
01:00:57.360 --> 01:00:58.440
Is she sipping her wine?

209e6fb8-099a-468b-9541-a35defad5192-0
01:00:58.440 --> 01:00:59.440
Does she nearly spit it out?

f9bb1225-0d1d-4d3f-8828-ba70658052ba-0
01:00:59.440 --> 01:01:01.888
Like,
what does I nearly choke actually look

f9bb1225-0d1d-4d3f-8828-ba70658052ba-1
01:01:01.888 --> 01:01:02.160
like?

670acd4f-9b1f-406f-b58a-9b9a49dba691-0
01:01:02.160 --> 01:01:05.600
Like that's a that's a broad summary that
could mean a lot of things.

797f7175-f43b-4b9f-8989-cc6388d909b7-0
01:01:06.040 --> 01:01:09.600
And, you know, if we're watching a movie,
what exactly does that look like?

b4fd269b-a791-42a2-89c6-1492a8a4b29b-0
01:01:09.600 --> 01:01:12.440
Sometimes you're going to have to skip
over that stuff just for word count.

c9e80d99-2330-454f-99b1-1d4fae2beb16-0
01:01:12.760 --> 01:01:13.720
But you've mentioned it.

4b67205f-128f-4c9e-bae4-8d3dcfdd8366-0
01:01:13.720 --> 01:01:16.591
So clearly it's important that she's had
that reaction,

4b67205f-128f-4c9e-bae4-8d3dcfdd8366-1
01:01:16.591 --> 01:01:19.360
and therefore it might be important to
fully show it.

b9d25317-7783-499f-9a02-3c26d6d548e7-0
01:01:19.680 --> 01:01:19.840
Yeah.

30a50b46-fefd-46ed-9234-346fa44d106b-0
01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:23.972
I feel like this is a general comment
about writing is that it is

30a50b46-fefd-46ed-9234-346fa44d106b-1
01:01:23.972 --> 01:01:26.440
counterintuitively maybe a visual medium.

fae0465a-b494-4cf8-8a28-09b3667e13e7-0
01:01:26.520 --> 01:01:29.555
Because what you're always doing is
painting a picture,

fae0465a-b494-4cf8-8a28-09b3667e13e7-1
01:01:29.555 --> 01:01:32.320
almost creating a movie in the mind of
the reader.

d81668b2-7c17-4f4f-a2e9-837a50f69e79-0
01:01:32.800 --> 01:01:37.293
And whenever you have something that is a
little bit ambiguous that the reader can

d81668b2-7c17-4f4f-a2e9-837a50f69e79-1
01:01:37.293 --> 01:01:41.190
interpret in more than one way,
like sometimes you want them to be able

d81668b2-7c17-4f4f-a2e9-837a50f69e79-2
01:01:41.190 --> 01:01:45.413
to do that or sometimes you want them to
be able to to think about a specific

d81668b2-7c17-4f4f-a2e9-837a50f69e79-3
01:01:45.413 --> 01:01:49.040
thing happening and visualise that in the
same way as you want to.

5ac05e09-f8fb-43c9-8d3e-92a054c43e69-0
01:01:49.720 --> 01:01:53.283
So with something like I nearly choke,
there are multiple ways you can imagine

5ac05e09-f8fb-43c9-8d3e-92a054c43e69-1
01:01:53.283 --> 01:01:53.960
that happening.

73efcd40-102c-4e3a-90e0-77236d6d4207-0
01:01:53.960 --> 01:01:57.880
Like they just kind of choke off to the
side or maybe they spray their drink out

73efcd40-102c-4e3a-90e0-77236d6d4207-1
01:01:57.880 --> 01:01:58.800
all over the place.

05fea468-9435-4f53-8d6e-ab239ed60ba2-0
01:01:59.120 --> 01:02:02.160
And all of those have different
connotations for the scene.

9a677a94-8395-4ac5-905b-f26cc802487e-0
01:02:02.640 --> 01:02:05.520
And you can tell your reader make a
choice.

507060bb-eb15-42f4-987e-e49b50a4236f-0
01:02:05.520 --> 01:02:06.960
How do you want this to play out?

789b2fdb-52e7-4ac8-a25b-2a5451e22239-0
01:02:06.960 --> 01:02:08.840
How do you think that might look?

f3646708-2ba3-4fcf-bd8a-0ce3558d19e4-0
01:02:09.200 --> 01:02:13.880
And whatever they choose might have
implications for the next line.

2f4ada42-c728-47e0-b537-1aacd61a0d92-0
01:02:14.000 --> 01:02:18.620
And what you risk is the next line
doesn't gel with what they've imagined to

2f4ada42-c728-47e0-b537-1aacd61a0d92-1
01:02:18.620 --> 01:02:19.040
happen.

af03e8ad-53a6-467e-a69d-2c4c41918493-0
01:02:19.320 --> 01:02:24.063
So that's something to be conscious of
that if you are trying to go from one

af03e8ad-53a6-467e-a69d-2c4c41918493-1
01:02:24.063 --> 01:02:28.436
beat to the next beat to the next beat
and you have an ambiguous line,

af03e8ad-53a6-467e-a69d-2c4c41918493-2
01:02:28.436 --> 01:02:31.640
it may not lead some readers directly to
that
Yeah.

97bd047d-0898-4c09-bf69-06e42afb48d6-0
01:02:31.640 --> 01:02:33.720
And I mean,
it doesn't have to be a lot more words.

96aaf306-3459-49e4-8e69-8adc190aa5ba-0
01:02:33.720 --> 01:02:36.207
I'm not saying like,
let's now dwell in this moment of her

96aaf306-3459-49e4-8e69-8adc190aa5ba-1
01:02:36.207 --> 01:02:36.840
nearly choking.

da18df78-e74d-4cda-831f-d64195d91bc1-0
01:02:36.840 --> 01:02:41.053
Like it can just be the same number of
words or just a couple more where she's

da18df78-e74d-4cda-831f-d64195d91bc1-1
01:02:41.053 --> 01:02:42.920
like, my wine catches in my throat.

0592e017-89ef-475a-a1a7-f3b3d61b5da7-0
01:02:42.920 --> 01:02:43.160
Yeah.

7a3ecdd5-291d-4304-a06e-4bf607d2cd9d-0
01:02:43.280 --> 01:02:46.040
And it sprays like, I don't know,
like it's it's.

cdfd7b7a-71a2-41ab-a569-f2ba4b7bcd71-0
01:02:46.080 --> 01:02:47.760
But that's now a visual, right?

83d7b0ac-8a6c-488a-8ceb-e2b857f25e53-0
01:02:47.760 --> 01:02:49.120
That's a specific visual.

ab590534-dd53-460e-9762-e95bad7d9ca5-0
01:02:49.240 --> 01:02:50.480
And I think that's all I'm saying.

51ecb9f3-2415-491d-b248-010a17a3745e-0
01:02:50.520 --> 01:02:52.480
Like, I don't need to linger there.

e332c590-ce4c-4136-9ebc-f7e7e96ff920-0
01:02:52.560 --> 01:02:56.420
We just, it's like, well,
what exactly was that moment is what I'm

e332c590-ce4c-4136-9ebc-f7e7e96ff920-1
01:02:56.420 --> 01:02:57.400
suggesting there.

73c6b74e-9d9b-4ab5-91aa-2e0f328fdc82-0
01:02:57.960 --> 01:03:00.720
What do you think about this dialogue in
general in the story?

4ecc2e01-75a2-422a-b79e-f8f98d9e0eae-0
01:03:01.400 --> 01:03:03.737
Look,
I'll say I found it hard to read when I

4ecc2e01-75a2-422a-b79e-f8f98d9e0eae-1
01:03:03.737 --> 01:03:05.160
was reading the story aloud.

7e17f235-f7a8-4ca0-8ef0-4c3f64b52280-0
01:03:05.160 --> 01:03:08.277
And I don't know if that's just me
because I'm awkward, but yeah,

7e17f235-f7a8-4ca0-8ef0-4c3f64b52280-1
01:03:08.277 --> 01:03:09.080
I'm not sure why.

6d9244cf-b2a5-4134-b410-a30c11452cf2-0
01:03:09.080 --> 01:03:09.880
What do you think?

6da691dd-f522-48b0-a249-29f799c9df3a-0
01:03:09.880 --> 01:03:11.120
What's what's your feeling?

1eecee0c-9f3d-4816-8852-eacd22c066b7-0
01:03:11.320 --> 01:03:15.195
Sometimes we give the critique for
dialogue that it doesn't really go

1eecee0c-9f3d-4816-8852-eacd22c066b7-1
01:03:15.195 --> 01:03:17.520
anywhere or it's not really for a purpose.

ebee27f0-a638-40bb-b8f7-5525b8649e37-0
01:03:17.920 --> 01:03:22.840
I felt this dialogue was for a purpose
and it was fairly natural.

40394f6c-c7df-40ed-95e7-9b57b3bc626d-0
01:03:22.840 --> 01:03:26.760
There wasn't a whole lot of just filler
dialogue.

9272cc47-67e8-4eba-8d50-91a90c5e5ea1-0
01:03:26.960 --> 01:03:31.240
And some of these phrases are very laden
with meaning and emotion.

d54f2d20-0565-4040-aee3-6ee47a21b4cc-0
01:03:31.240 --> 01:03:35.480
Like, so you're just stood there watching,
you know, it's quite heavy.

3307e8bc-4b95-407a-835f-94645d211c23-0
01:03:35.800 --> 01:03:36.560
Yeah, exactly.

77ab261b-2f8e-42cf-9a31-20c775fa69f3-0
01:03:36.560 --> 01:03:37.800
There's a lot in there.

4ad93d73-37ec-4b26-951d-78bd72da92a2-0
01:03:38.120 --> 01:03:41.751
And because I watched you read the story,
like, yeah, some of these,

4ad93d73-37ec-4b26-951d-78bd72da92a2-1
01:03:41.751 --> 01:03:45.120
you're not quite sure how how to read
them or what the tone is.

29e2c891-4474-402b-bf3c-233e735f3057-0
01:03:45.120 --> 01:03:47.040
That's difficult to do sometimes.

00b24d60-a3cd-4d74-b0f3-a72460e5fe09-0
01:03:47.280 --> 01:03:49.560
But I thought it was quite good dialogue
from that perspective.

f9350b5c-621a-4c07-b566-0375b6fe39ea-0
01:03:49.560 --> 01:03:53.805
It was pushing towards,
I guess a goal and every line seemed to

f9350b5c-621a-4c07-b566-0375b6fe39ea-1
01:03:53.805 --> 01:03:55.000
have that in mind.

c98e5fb1-b08b-4526-b95a-962137dcf6a3-0
01:03:55.720 --> 01:03:58.957
Well, and and look,
maybe it's a case of maybe removing some

c98e5fb1-b08b-4526-b95a-962137dcf6a3-1
01:03:58.957 --> 01:04:03.203
of that stage direction in the dialogue
and just letting it speak for itself to

c98e5fb1-b08b-4526-b95a-962137dcf6a3-2
01:04:03.203 --> 01:04:03.839
some extent.

6c90cd8a-ac43-477c-8442-43826faca7c1-0
01:04:03.840 --> 01:04:06.480
So we have this half mortified,
half delighted.

c0ce37f9-3699-4202-a7db-2dd20a161ff2-0
01:04:06.480 --> 01:04:07.960
I say you are very forward.

48f22f4b-e5cf-4b08-87f2-ee79607d64d5-0
01:04:08.280 --> 01:04:11.800
Could she not just say you are very
forward, You know, you're very forward.

0503f1d5-963b-404c-b3e6-1dffbe510e11-0
01:04:11.800 --> 01:04:13.640
He's like, I like the show too.

2c0d83c4-563b-4fa9-9fb3-4bef67aa6839-0
01:04:13.640 --> 01:04:15.520
You don't need to give us the the build
up.

42bdd39b-35be-4778-a001-5c0dc9ce3ec7-0
01:04:16.040 --> 01:04:16.400
Right.

e094a142-1591-4951-b7a1-1d9be8d42cfb-0
01:04:16.400 --> 01:04:17.960
And also that he replies softly.

4ab1a43c-b641-4490-ba49-891eca2d2af8-0
01:04:17.960 --> 01:04:20.760
I've learned not to waste time like that
can really be cut down.

b61f0599-55eb-4b45-ba82-3062d99c44e2-0
01:04:20.760 --> 01:04:22.760
Yeah, just I've learned not to waste time.

dacc1c15-48e0-4753-a56d-dfd8c7cc5e88-0
01:04:23.040 --> 01:04:24.520
That line speaks for itself.

e13fd94e-df1f-4c35-a6cc-e0f9d96b96b4-0
01:04:24.880 --> 01:04:27.654
So yeah, maybe that's an element there,
Jenny, as well,

e13fd94e-df1f-4c35-a6cc-e0f9d96b96b4-1
01:04:27.654 --> 01:04:31.074
of trust your reader a little bit,
letting them just experience that

e13fd94e-df1f-4c35-a6cc-e0f9d96b96b4-2
01:04:31.074 --> 01:04:31.520
dialogue.

96b341c7-6d3e-48c9-adc0-46b76d51bf9c-0
01:04:31.520 --> 01:04:34.632
And I think to some extent,
readers will experience it slightly

96b341c7-6d3e-48c9-adc0-46b76d51bf9c-1
01:04:34.632 --> 01:04:37.064
differently,
but all of those experiences will be

96b341c7-6d3e-48c9-adc0-46b76d51bf9c-2
01:04:37.064 --> 01:04:37.600
satisfying.

309c0194-9979-450a-a427-c16d4db8b3c7-0
01:04:37.600 --> 01:04:40.735
Like when I read that,
that'll be laden with people I know and

309c0194-9979-450a-a427-c16d4db8b3c7-1
01:04:40.735 --> 01:04:44.518
experiences I've had and people I've
talked to and and those voices will be

309c0194-9979-450a-a427-c16d4db8b3c7-2
01:04:44.518 --> 01:04:46.360
coming through when I'm reading this.

bea035d9-a488-4170-99b3-379b0aae28e4-0
01:04:46.360 --> 01:04:48.840
And that might be slightly different to
the way you read it, Ed.

29167093-d3f1-4230-9d2e-b73a6c98a49b-0
01:04:48.840 --> 01:04:51.686
And you hear,
maybe I hear him as more confident and

29167093-d3f1-4230-9d2e-b73a6c98a49b-1
01:04:51.686 --> 01:04:54.480
you hear him as more timid or whatever it
might be.

7e69a3ec-89c8-457b-8aa6-be64649aebf7-0
01:04:54.480 --> 01:04:56.360
But that's my experience now.

c16eed48-7f29-459d-aa76-e1d19509cfe4-0
01:04:56.360 --> 01:05:00.082
I get to have that of this story and,
and you don't necessarily need to hold my

c16eed48-7f29-459d-aa76-e1d19509cfe4-1
01:05:00.082 --> 01:05:00.920
hand through that.

c22991fc-24be-41c1-ae23-ac8adf72558b-0
01:05:01.360 --> 01:05:04.282
We're just watching like these two people
interact and,

c22991fc-24be-41c1-ae23-ac8adf72558b-1
01:05:04.282 --> 01:05:06.840
and it's like a satisfying experience in
itself.

1819fc8f-a8df-43d9-bf93-0dceffbfea56-0
01:05:06.840 --> 01:05:10.257
We don't need to sort of be told how
we're supposed to feel about what they're

1819fc8f-a8df-43d9-bf93-0dceffbfea56-1
01:05:10.257 --> 01:05:10.560
saying.

54e91185-dd1b-4fd0-a83d-e61c91fe41e7-0
01:05:11.120 --> 01:05:13.723
And similarly, you know,
at the end of this section,

54e91185-dd1b-4fd0-a83d-e61c91fe41e7-1
01:05:13.723 --> 01:05:17.457
this moment where it says I sit quietly,
my heart unexpectedly light to me,

54e91185-dd1b-4fd0-a83d-e61c91fe41e7-2
01:05:17.457 --> 01:05:18.440
that's very telling.

7ad8e02f-8bf4-4cd0-b131-33b7690c6aa9-0
01:05:18.760 --> 01:05:21.360
You're telling us how we're supposed to
feel about this moment.

a8ad31c7-d9d2-4d35-a215-8f91078016f0-0
01:05:21.600 --> 01:05:24.723
You could leave us with, like,
a man who understands the art of good

a8ad31c7-d9d2-4d35-a215-8f91078016f0-1
01:05:24.723 --> 01:05:25.040
timing.

200bfd5b-abe5-4918-84d7-198fbc6038a4-0
01:05:25.240 --> 01:05:27.080
That in itself tells us a lot.

70f4dbd0-6223-4feb-a611-c784f63369af-0
01:05:27.560 --> 01:05:29.915
You know,
she's not ready to go any further than

70f4dbd0-6223-4feb-a611-c784f63369af-1
01:05:29.915 --> 01:05:32.127
that,
but she's still thinking of him in that

70f4dbd0-6223-4feb-a611-c784f63369af-2
01:05:32.127 --> 01:05:32.320
way.

5769e3ba-0abe-499d-990f-ade3e6db12ec-0
01:05:32.880 --> 01:05:34.280
And then we cut to the next scene.

bbf12535-45c3-40bd-bf97-4110fcd25374-0
01:05:34.280 --> 01:05:34.560
Yeah.

8b2f45d7-5d0d-4aae-9dc8-ce5cd10e57a9-0
01:05:34.680 --> 01:05:39.146
So in this next scene, we get this,
this moment where she becomes the

8b2f45d7-5d0d-4aae-9dc8-ce5cd10e57a9-1
01:05:39.146 --> 01:05:40.040
exhibitionist.

3c85007d-1079-405a-ae8b-a3b496bb13d4-0
01:05:40.040 --> 01:05:44.379
So, wiggling my toes on the Dewey grass,
I stare at the shower head hanging

3c85007d-1079-405a-ae8b-a3b496bb13d4-1
01:05:44.379 --> 01:05:47.520
ominously untouched since the summer of
Jacob's death.

566e7e24-8f01-4b3e-96a4-e74fd85ff5e2-0
01:05:47.600 --> 01:05:51.960
Cobwebs thicker than the ones on my
vagina hover in the corner.

09672273-bd2d-4f7d-aa4a-38ecb3ea4eab-0
01:05:52.280 --> 01:05:54.800
And that's a fun line,
but such a drop dead Fred moment.

03dc94d2-ea72-4269-8367-c264d5cdde15-0
01:05:54.800 --> 01:05:57.858
Yeah,
I'll also say it is a bit of a change in

03dc94d2-ea72-4269-8367-c264d5cdde15-1
01:05:57.858 --> 01:05:58.640
tone for me.

cee27af9-72b8-4c14-9087-4e07f810adb1-0
01:05:58.640 --> 01:06:03.120
Like, it stood out as just like,
a bit of a funny image in the middle of,

cee27af9-72b8-4c14-9087-4e07f810adb1-1
01:06:03.120 --> 01:06:05.360
I guess, what was not a funny moment.

c16c0d87-6d9b-4a7b-b141-011a3db95fc9-0
01:06:05.360 --> 01:06:08.426
She's kind of thinking about the fact
that she hasn't, you know,

c16c0d87-6d9b-4a7b-b141-011a3db95fc9-1
01:06:08.426 --> 01:06:11.824
touched this shower since that time,
and she's thinking about doing it,

c16c0d87-6d9b-4a7b-b141-011a3db95fc9-2
01:06:11.824 --> 01:06:15.080
but we're kind of stuck on the cobwebs in
the vagina in that moment.

a7a78aeb-7e80-406c-a9be-425d3489dacf-0
01:06:15.080 --> 01:06:17.000
So no, I think you're right there.

d34f652e-3e95-4226-bd35-78f002ee9655-0
01:06:17.480 --> 01:06:19.543
If you did wanna keep it and you're
keeping that,

d34f652e-3e95-4226-bd35-78f002ee9655-1
01:06:19.543 --> 01:06:21.978
I guess it's an essence of character
voice to some extent,

d34f652e-3e95-4226-bd35-78f002ee9655-2
01:06:21.978 --> 01:06:23.960
if they're still having a laugh in this
moment.

cbeacefe-0725-49c1-957c-56a85a04406a-0
01:06:23.960 --> 01:06:24.960
So that's an option.

d8b2bbab-e22b-441c-84a1-e23220e575c1-0
01:06:25.560 --> 01:06:29.028
I tend to agree with you that maybe it's
something that even though it's funny,

d8b2bbab-e22b-441c-84a1-e23220e575c1-1
01:06:29.028 --> 01:06:30.720
might not be quite fitting of the tone.

d49632bf-8de5-4bce-aa51-37f3f2651379-0
01:06:30.720 --> 01:06:34.467
But if you were going to keep a little
tip that, I don't know where I read it,

d49632bf-8de5-4bce-aa51-37f3f2651379-1
01:06:34.467 --> 01:06:38.120
but I love this tip and I think about it
constantly when it comes to comedy.

6ea7baad-7e58-4c66-9ae0-7d5826b7d3a2-0
01:06:38.120 --> 01:06:41.522
But is to save the punchline to the last
bit of the sentence,

6ea7baad-7e58-4c66-9ae0-7d5826b7d3a2-1
01:06:41.522 --> 01:06:42.840
the end of the sentence.

2e1341b6-e4bb-4a39-b9e4-104e3c82ba25-0
01:06:42.840 --> 01:06:46.680
So we have cobwebs thicker than the ones
on my vagina hover in the corner.

9ffc5edb-e8f4-4a19-b9f7-f986684f3402-0
01:06:47.000 --> 01:06:49.320
In the corner is the end of that sentence.

4fce79e0-635d-4e53-b99f-131d4aa72e0c-0
01:06:49.320 --> 01:06:51.560
And that's not the funny bit you would
say.

2e13344d-e46e-4c20-9a5b-4fbf9deb9f03-0
01:06:52.040 --> 01:06:54.760
There's cobwebs in the corner thicker
than the ones on my vagina.

4f2f9863-54d7-497d-b34d-82ef7f37b1e5-0
01:06:55.040 --> 01:06:56.720
And that's where you end that sentence.

6806c9e8-7f88-4d05-b3c0-547a8354e89c-0
01:06:57.160 --> 01:06:58.200
I mean, that's by the by.

9bdccada-886e-43cf-ac5e-f9ad71a443e9-0
01:06:58.200 --> 01:07:01.360
Because I'm not sure that we're trying to
be, like, as comedic here.

8c793c4f-0729-4858-b3df-b6f5281d39b0-0
01:07:01.360 --> 01:07:04.120
But just a little hot tip I picked up
somewhere along the way.

40aa7d0d-f921-461f-bfe9-a2e5789e16f8-0
01:07:04.200 --> 01:07:06.520
I do think it helps the comedy land.

65881c4e-8aea-4d9e-942a-12d1f4784479-0
01:07:06.640 --> 01:07:11.023
Or maybe you can rephrase that as
something a little bit more subtle,

65881c4e-8aea-4d9e-942a-12d1f4784479-1
01:07:11.023 --> 01:07:15.844
like observing the cobwebs and then
reflecting somehow on the vagina without

65881c4e-8aea-4d9e-942a-12d1f4784479-2
01:07:15.844 --> 01:07:20.040
explicitly calling it out in a way that
the reader can understand.

fa66de5e-23b9-4d17-9f71-3d8ad71ddf5c-0
01:07:20.040 --> 01:07:21.080
Like, there's that option as well.

25625291-1e77-4c0e-bf45-19c2f57242d1-0
01:07:21.080 --> 01:07:21.680
Yeah, True.

74b8d284-37ef-4458-b4e1-3dd1484e9fdc-0
01:07:22.120 --> 01:07:24.735
And as we're coming up to this climactic
moment here,

74b8d284-37ef-4458-b4e1-3dd1484e9fdc-1
01:07:24.735 --> 01:07:28.320
we are getting a little bit more of that
naming of emotion kind of stuff.

dd101024-5d95-4585-91d0-1a2eaa16f88f-0
01:07:28.320 --> 01:07:31.000
And like there's some very obvious
moments where that happens.

20b45ad6-b2d1-4133-8034-6f418832d43c-0
01:07:31.000 --> 01:07:34.200
Timidity, sadness,
confidence and excitement swell like

20b45ad6-b2d1-4133-8034-6f418832d43c-1
01:07:34.200 --> 01:07:34.600
static.

be7f3fcc-9a2a-4177-9375-43f6fa6a2a9b-0
01:07:35.200 --> 01:07:39.175
I think when you are trying to build
empathy on the part of your reader,

be7f3fcc-9a2a-4177-9375-43f6fa6a2a9b-1
01:07:39.175 --> 01:07:43.423
it is difficult for a reader to really
empathise with three separate emotions

be7f3fcc-9a2a-4177-9375-43f6fa6a2a9b-2
01:07:43.423 --> 01:07:44.840
swirling around like that.

36e7084e-efe5-4183-baca-d9bb58ef721d-0
01:07:45.240 --> 01:07:47.634
So I mean,
not to harp on this because we've already

36e7084e-efe5-4183-baca-d9bb58ef721d-1
01:07:47.634 --> 01:07:50.480
talked about naming an emotion,
but I guess that's the danger.

af4c572f-63d4-44d0-99e8-b3c81c886e9d-0
01:07:50.480 --> 01:07:55.543
When you name a complex emotion,
it's hard to be empathetic to that when

af4c572f-63d4-44d0-99e8-b3c81c886e9d-1
01:07:55.543 --> 01:07:57.000
it is quite abstract.

91fd1630-729d-4952-bbc0-a773b36b1a23-0
01:07:57.440 --> 01:08:01.267
You're better off focusing in on that
action and just let them connect with the

91fd1630-729d-4952-bbc0-a773b36b1a23-1
01:08:01.267 --> 01:08:04.855
scene directly rather than kind of
through your authorial layer of telling

91fd1630-729d-4952-bbc0-a773b36b1a23-2
01:08:04.855 --> 01:08:06.960
them how that character's feeling and
look.

0e6b8853-02d7-407f-8d46-bb46315f8048-0
01:08:06.960 --> 01:08:08.520
This is all very interesting.

4c1eb4fd-fcc7-4830-868e-0b5198736d8c-0
01:08:08.520 --> 01:08:12.701
You know, I love talking about writing,
but I also want to talk about a couple of

4c1eb4fd-fcc7-4830-868e-0b5198736d8c-1
01:08:12.701 --> 01:08:15.200
little like more ****** fiction specific
things.

955a14a9-2b93-40aa-a54d-6d024807983c-0
01:08:15.200 --> 01:08:18.239
So one, and again,
this sort of comes from my experience now

955a14a9-2b93-40aa-a54d-6d024807983c-1
01:08:18.239 --> 01:08:20.880
of editing some of these stories for the
collection.

6877e163-687f-4e57-8c61-5c13dd73ac57-0
01:08:21.360 --> 01:08:22.680
We've got this line here.

accaff7a-db3f-4bc9-9ccb-79dc7e121484-0
01:08:22.760 --> 01:08:25.040
My body quivers from head to toe.

108562df-3ac4-4f26-a863-281ea0e84f3b-0
01:08:25.720 --> 01:08:28.280
Now this is an important piece of action.

83006071-7ef2-445c-ba8f-718aa0b44296-0
01:08:28.280 --> 01:08:30.934
You know,
we're building towards a climax here,

83006071-7ef2-445c-ba8f-718aa0b44296-1
01:08:30.934 --> 01:08:32.760
but I would say, aha, very funny.

1c63b284-774f-4d22-94d2-dffce6ee05e4-0
01:08:33.080 --> 01:08:37.053
I would say watch out for that kind of
idiomatic phrasing when we're talking

1c63b284-774f-4d22-94d2-dffce6ee05e4-1
01:08:37.053 --> 01:08:39.840
about something that is like the climax
of the story.

5213b5f2-9ae7-43cf-847f-6e6482aea1f8-0
01:08:39.840 --> 01:08:44.600
We're leaning now on a phrase we've heard
1000 times before from head to toe.

ece7005e-1fcd-41ba-a8f1-87f9e5439acf-0
01:08:44.640 --> 01:08:46.400
And that feels like a summary.

a0820cfb-07f3-4524-9833-1131fb1dd31b-0
01:08:46.440 --> 01:08:50.680
It doesn't feel special and inviting and
enticing and, and like, compelling.

67c72bd8-a259-4055-955b-1f0881954d79-0
01:08:50.680 --> 01:08:50.920
Yeah.

c54bc129-7bf0-48e6-a639-3d797a2b9fee-0
01:08:50.920 --> 01:08:53.160
It just feels like an explanation.

70a377e3-4c76-4932-914d-9c7476bbb48c-0
01:08:53.160 --> 01:08:53.560
I agree.

f94280a1-6413-46b0-a7d8-a7401f69872d-0
01:08:53.560 --> 01:08:57.990
And and also that that kind of phrasing
is something that you would see when you

f94280a1-6413-46b0-a7d8-a7401f69872d-1
01:08:57.990 --> 01:08:59.960
are trying to avoid explicit detail.

7084fec5-3ed0-493b-b832-e3c333d0dac6-0
01:09:00.240 --> 01:09:03.880
And the previous paragraph has a fair
amount of explicit detail.

90d8417f-fd86-4d1f-9a83-497dcbdff547-0
01:09:03.880 --> 01:09:09.305
There's like finger down to my clip
tracing tight circles ever so slowly go

90d8417f-fd86-4d1f-9a83-497dcbdff547-1
01:09:09.305 --> 01:09:09.520
on.

759d67a5-889f-4c04-96f9-a5e7bdfd6dbc-0
01:09:10.000 --> 01:09:13.720
So there is there is explicitness there.

be757546-5334-4b33-9434-9c67df45c696-0
01:09:14.120 --> 01:09:17.960
So it's not like Jenny's shying away from
talking about it.

599164a2-4b11-43b4-bcf0-214f3c292a73-0
01:09:17.960 --> 01:09:20.080
So I think there is an opportunity to
escalate.

d62faf1e-087a-4b5a-aad3-e4b1da0c9666-0
01:09:20.080 --> 01:09:23.755
And if that situation is escalating and
we're getting to that moment,

d62faf1e-087a-4b5a-aad3-e4b1da0c9666-1
01:09:23.755 --> 01:09:26.800
then describe that moment in more
explicit terms as well.

c95179c1-3154-4d39-aa2c-6585904fd1a8-0
01:09:27.080 --> 01:09:30.760
And it's hard because I think this is the
part and Jenny's saying this is the first

c95179c1-3154-4d39-aa2c-6585904fd1a8-1
01:09:30.760 --> 01:09:31.680
time she's done this.

b81adc16-886e-4262-a5e0-e39921a73577-0
01:09:31.680 --> 01:09:35.960
We don't normally necessarily talk like
that or even think like that.

b477f188-635a-411a-a41a-2bd7bb5312dd-0
01:09:35.960 --> 01:09:39.920
Like, you might have that moment,
but you're not necessarily analysing it.

9a4749b4-f623-4f6f-8caf-c49bdedaa9e5-0
01:09:39.920 --> 01:09:41.680
And like, what is happening in my body?

7d2b5e94-036d-4cda-806b-f43c70bcf658-0
01:09:41.880 --> 01:09:42.800
This moment is happening.

b4ed67cc-f163-406c-a117-17322c617c4b-0
01:09:43.040 --> 01:09:44.880
But as a writer,
that's what you've got to do.

b6deeb0e-ea19-4c2c-b079-9e758fe25824-0
01:09:44.880 --> 01:09:48.432
You've got to reflect back and go,
what physical thing is happening in that

b6deeb0e-ea19-4c2c-b079-9e758fe25824-1
01:09:48.432 --> 01:09:48.760
moment?

e149d15c-c6bb-4142-87ed-42d52197b664-0
01:09:48.760 --> 01:09:49.240
Like what?

453418dc-96a1-4103-9028-7444aafa1132-0
01:09:49.440 --> 01:09:50.400
What's happening in my body?

7dbb68a8-9488-4675-8eef-f1b5d59a17c8-0
01:09:50.400 --> 01:09:51.320
What does that feel like?

7c6969ae-4d34-403a-80a9-8997f991f581-0
01:09:51.320 --> 01:09:54.160
Not just quivers from head to toe,
but like, specifically.

0d20383c-26db-4e93-9e7a-17e5328b3a62-0
01:09:54.200 --> 01:09:56.723
And I think as a reader,
that is what is exciting,

0d20383c-26db-4e93-9e7a-17e5328b3a62-1
01:09:56.723 --> 01:10:00.731
is to have that experience mirrored back
in a way that you haven't thought about

0d20383c-26db-4e93-9e7a-17e5328b3a62-2
01:10:00.731 --> 01:10:00.880
it.

cfd9b4bd-2697-45ec-9708-44cade51c323-0
01:10:00.880 --> 01:10:02.000
Yeah, absolutely.

9c83ff50-fa01-4417-aafc-324aade2091b-0
01:10:02.000 --> 01:10:03.880
And I mean,
that's the case for all writing.

3bef5cd3-aab0-43b3-8fdf-6ee1a82ab94f-0
01:10:03.880 --> 01:10:08.145
But I think all the more important here,
this sensory experience of what it's like

3bef5cd3-aab0-43b3-8fdf-6ee1a82ab94f-1
01:10:08.145 --> 01:10:11.280
to have an orgasm is like,
that's what people came here for.

e4276e5f-e501-4b01-8f2a-0751057a33ac-0
01:10:11.600 --> 01:10:13.982
And,
and so I think it pays to think a little

e4276e5f-e501-4b01-8f2a-0751057a33ac-1
01:10:13.982 --> 01:10:17.090
bit more deeply about that and deliver
that because that's,

e4276e5f-e501-4b01-8f2a-0751057a33ac-2
01:10:17.090 --> 01:10:18.800
that's a big part of the package.

82db756d-456b-4e90-8482-0eb8e47a6dca-0
01:10:19.320 --> 01:10:23.316
And we move on two nights later,
we've got some lovely sensory detail

82db756d-456b-4e90-8482-0eb8e47a6dca-1
01:10:23.316 --> 01:10:26.000
again, that's your secret,
the sensory detail.

b2bdb84b-01c9-4fde-b5a5-abe670201a1c-0
01:10:26.200 --> 01:10:27.320
What does it smell like?

1e63910b-f0c1-4e46-869e-3d53fe433ca2-0
01:10:27.320 --> 01:10:28.480
What does it sound like?

5d0dbbdb-6d83-442e-85fd-a6a243876ede-0
01:10:28.880 --> 01:10:30.120
You know, what does it taste like?

2cd5b60e-63f5-4d79-a57b-c8fcef53f4bd-0
01:10:30.120 --> 01:10:32.156
Like what it,
what are all the senses that are

2cd5b60e-63f5-4d79-a57b-c8fcef53f4bd-1
01:10:32.156 --> 01:10:33.240
happening in this moment?

e4759b40-55f0-4bb8-bbab-8dad7a50ffff-0
01:10:33.240 --> 01:10:36.800
Like not all at once when we don't want
to overdo it,

e4759b40-55f0-4bb8-bbab-8dad7a50ffff-1
01:10:36.800 --> 01:10:41.680
but what is 1 specific little tiny detail
that encapsulates that feeling?

1f900f98-2e9a-4f51-a3ed-0fe0c7fd7ac3-0
01:10:41.800 --> 01:10:44.480
I think that's the kind of thing to
strive for.

8a683091-a590-4a38-84d1-7bbe9e3c209c-0
01:10:45.040 --> 01:10:48.422
So coming up,
there's one little line that as we were

8a683091-a590-4a38-84d1-7bbe9e3c209c-1
01:10:48.422 --> 01:10:53.434
reading, as Amanda was reading the story,
we wanted to kind of come back to and

8a683091-a590-4a38-84d1-7bbe9e3c209c-2
01:10:53.434 --> 01:10:56.879
talk about,
and that was consumed by a single thought.

206e75b7-c1e6-40ab-83ef-5e6a83759f95-0
01:10:57.120 --> 01:11:01.080
I **** my **** purposely imagining
someone who isn't Jacob.

ee1ff541-c677-4df8-ac9d-58c877c3bb6e-0
01:11:01.760 --> 01:11:03.480
So what are your thoughts about this line,
Amanda?

9fffda30-88d7-437d-8e22-d42c3b9079cf-0
01:11:03.680 --> 01:11:08.141
I will say **** my **** was a bit of a
jackknife kind of moment for me when I

9fffda30-88d7-437d-8e22-d42c3b9079cf-1
01:11:08.141 --> 01:11:09.400
was reading the story.

5aa05a97-9076-4b95-9df6-f63b1c8c44c5-0
01:11:09.800 --> 01:11:12.480
It's not a descriptor I would ever use.

296f461d-6aa2-4434-8cc4-d9ebbc994e1f-0
01:11:12.480 --> 01:11:14.960
Like,
it just didn't feel quite right to me.

61d30770-a8c0-406c-b60e-bd572c1d87de-0
01:11:15.320 --> 01:11:17.240
And so I found it very distracting.

bd35c211-3d0a-43d6-bf08-2b959c57a908-0
01:11:17.360 --> 01:11:17.880
Yeah.

ae6a7bda-f7a3-44d5-87c2-492a1219590f-0
01:11:17.880 --> 01:11:18.400
What about you?

1b803b40-d2d0-46e4-9339-2298a9c83e62-0
01:11:19.120 --> 01:11:21.833
It's a moment that made me think, OK,
so tonally, like,

1b803b40-d2d0-46e4-9339-2298a9c83e62-1
01:11:21.833 --> 01:11:24.160
the word **** has come up before in this
story.

aff591ab-43d2-43e4-955b-0272bcc2aad0-0
01:11:24.160 --> 01:11:25.720
It's not like, new or anything.

7e0949d2-b23b-4b5c-8248-146e510efabf-0
01:11:25.720 --> 01:11:28.040
And then the word **** is not new either.

9938a6ac-1f3f-4b9c-ba94-5dc222d106d3-0
01:11:28.640 --> 01:11:32.200
I don't think we talk about ***** in the
context of them being ******.

c94081fd-49a8-4279-b66c-31381b9cc5d7-0
01:11:32.360 --> 01:11:32.760
No.

81a4f91c-a721-4258-864f-c12e1887466e-0
01:11:32.760 --> 01:11:34.560
And that's an interesting thought.

69c23ba1-0325-442d-96f9-85af54c62ee8-0
01:11:34.560 --> 01:11:35.440
And that's what I'm saying.

721c628e-0f67-42a9-a1cf-e7aed82a2b15-0
01:11:35.440 --> 01:11:36.720
It made me think about.

e6dfd648-0028-4159-845e-fa98edbb6a78-0
01:11:37.800 --> 01:11:40.800
I remember you went you went somewhere
very new in your mind palace.

fa51614e-6ede-49b8-bc2f-1885de01f2ac-0
01:11:40.800 --> 01:11:44.231
No, I look,
I remember listening to a podcast many

fa51614e-6ede-49b8-bc2f-1885de01f2ac-1
01:11:44.231 --> 01:11:47.730
years ago,
like a sex based podcast and it featured

fa51614e-6ede-49b8-bc2f-1885de01f2ac-2
01:11:47.730 --> 01:11:50.960
like a lesbian and a gay man talking
about sex.

60a1c68c-879f-4689-aff6-0d52a5c1414d-0
01:11:51.360 --> 01:11:55.566
And at one point the lesbian was talking
about ******* another woman and the gay

60a1c68c-879f-4689-aff6-0d52a5c1414d-1
01:11:55.566 --> 01:11:57.280
man was like, that's not *******.

17a048e2-8976-4963-b473-6b6ef8ce65a9-0
01:11:57.480 --> 01:11:59.960
Like, that's not,
that's not what let me show you.

90e98ce8-76de-407a-b5c0-3a44a5d12132-0
01:11:59.960 --> 01:12:03.002
And no,
because we we have an idea that it's

90e98ce8-76de-407a-b5c0-3a44a5d12132-1
01:12:03.002 --> 01:12:04.760
******* means penetration.

71335632-b1e5-4f39-8e7c-e044036b0ea4-0
01:12:04.760 --> 01:12:05.000
Yeah.

0dc39ef5-d05a-41a1-a09c-a8c5b882970b-0
01:12:05.280 --> 01:12:07.720
And that's kind of baked into it, right?

c01850c0-a5fc-4573-a3b0-c09f171557a6-0
01:12:07.720 --> 01:12:10.680
And so when you talk about ******* a ****
it's different.

5ab5955b-c9f3-4136-83ff-737d9ab63d86-0
01:12:10.920 --> 01:12:15.470
And immediately we think that's not
******* jars, but it's also like,

5ab5955b-c9f3-4136-83ff-737d9ab63d86-1
01:12:15.470 --> 01:12:16.120
but it is.

a28ddb1d-ed52-4e3d-8e32-b261a6085d32-0
01:12:16.160 --> 01:12:16.400
Yeah.

2211063f-d76a-4de0-bd2d-1b54313d8fd5-0
01:12:16.400 --> 01:12:17.360
Also, yeah.

57cf5d99-ca43-456e-b814-a339068e90e2-0
01:12:17.440 --> 01:12:20.009
For me,
that line reframed or helped make me

57cf5d99-ca43-456e-b814-a339068e90e2-1
01:12:20.009 --> 01:12:23.720
reconsider what that means and what my
assumptions are about it.

73a77f60-3102-4e2f-b46d-5e5812c59e06-0
01:12:24.040 --> 01:12:25.280
So I thought that was interesting.

863122d2-92ef-414a-bd24-877d7579113b-0
01:12:25.560 --> 01:12:29.116
But I also think that's not necessarily
what you want to be thinking in that

863122d2-92ef-414a-bd24-877d7579113b-1
01:12:29.116 --> 01:12:29.440
moment.

b12cb707-e0a7-4911-9ac2-fa8dd8a6b776-0
01:12:29.440 --> 01:12:32.653
So maybe that's like you say,
Jack and I for a little bit of an issue

b12cb707-e0a7-4911-9ac2-fa8dd8a6b776-1
01:12:32.653 --> 01:12:34.720
because it does take you out of that
moment.

bd62ff03-94c1-4d2d-96de-fedceb7585f4-0
01:12:34.720 --> 01:12:36.920
I would call it jarring, definitely.

364a0d9b-2548-444b-8bbc-251445ad1380-0
01:12:36.920 --> 01:12:39.880
And you're free to describe things
however you want.

1c83dcf7-02b9-4ce3-8b99-a581f5506f74-0
01:12:39.880 --> 01:12:42.174
But at the same time,
if you're thinking about the reader's

1c83dcf7-02b9-4ce3-8b99-a581f5506f74-1
01:12:42.174 --> 01:12:44.124
experience,
you have to think about that stuff and

1c83dcf7-02b9-4ce3-8b99-a581f5506f74-2
01:12:44.124 --> 01:12:45.080
how that's going to land.

47e45d54-7bcd-4598-b78b-dd6d990d2807-0
01:12:45.120 --> 01:12:47.787
And for me,
it didn't land perhaps in the way it was

47e45d54-7bcd-4598-b78b-dd6d990d2807-1
01:12:47.787 --> 01:12:48.240
intended.

2aeb7bf2-d37d-4355-933b-1fec6835b3e8-0
01:12:48.480 --> 01:12:54.029
What I will say does emphasise is,
and this is from my experience writing my

2aeb7bf2-d37d-4355-933b-1fec6835b3e8-1
01:12:54.029 --> 01:12:58.858
own flesh fiction story,
thinking about how the voice might change

2aeb7bf2-d37d-4355-933b-1fec6835b3e8-2
01:12:58.858 --> 01:13:03.760
depending on the heightened level of
enthusiasm of the protagonist.

f3ce1904-e457-4a10-988f-7f6a2862d6a7-0
01:13:04.080 --> 01:13:07.518
So if the protagonist is kind of warming
up or not really into it,

f3ce1904-e457-4a10-988f-7f6a2862d6a7-1
01:13:07.518 --> 01:13:10.802
they might use certain words,
but if they're really like close,

f3ce1904-e457-4a10-988f-7f6a2862d6a7-2
01:13:10.802 --> 01:13:14.445
then they might be just like,
So what that highlights to me is that in

f3ce1904-e457-4a10-988f-7f6a2862d6a7-3
01:13:14.445 --> 01:13:16.959
that moment,
that protagonist is really into it.

e6af50dd-0d4e-441b-8913-f2cad7f38361-0
01:13:16.960 --> 01:13:18.760
And that's what they're kind of thinking.

68ade4fb-71bb-41a4-81f4-db86f7f203ce-0
01:13:19.240 --> 01:13:22.723
They're thinking in terms of like,
**** my Clinton, not just more delicate,

68ade4fb-71bb-41a4-81f4-db86f7f203ce-1
01:13:22.723 --> 01:13:23.640
yeah, kind of terms.

c29e7419-740f-41c9-93e0-ce5aedfd2379-0
01:13:23.640 --> 01:13:24.600
So no, you're right.

2d3d8a57-5cef-4324-a9a5-488f35eeeca5-0
01:13:24.600 --> 01:13:26.794
I mean,
I think definitely like the aggression or

2d3d8a57-5cef-4324-a9a5-488f35eeeca5-1
01:13:26.794 --> 01:13:29.296
whatever you might with the intensity of
the wording is,

2d3d8a57-5cef-4324-a9a5-488f35eeeca5-2
01:13:29.296 --> 01:13:31.360
is definitely what you're searching for
there.

4a1fa2ca-6045-4f45-839b-553c10074b57-0
01:13:31.840 --> 01:13:33.280
Another point that comes up for me.

039a8e17-ebbc-4068-a4ca-01a389fa9326-0
01:13:33.280 --> 01:13:34.960
And this is just an opportunity, right?

cb48b214-4f0a-48b0-94fd-19ff47e6521a-0
01:13:34.960 --> 01:13:37.120
Like if I'm getting into the the weeds on
it.

58daf559-69c9-4c93-bcc8-59d45ab278b5-0
01:13:37.480 --> 01:13:41.808
There's a moment further down where she's
reading the note from Cooper that he's

58daf559-69c9-4c93-bcc8-59d45ab278b5-1
01:13:41.808 --> 01:13:44.855
he's left on the back table,
which is great, by the way,

58daf559-69c9-4c93-bcc8-59d45ab278b5-2
01:13:44.855 --> 01:13:48.970
Love that love that he just comes,
leaves a note and walks away like this is

58daf559-69c9-4c93-bcc8-59d45ab278b5-3
01:13:48.970 --> 01:13:50.360
all great yearning loveth.

dda7aaff-7813-47fa-8330-64e5fc327ab7-0
01:13:50.880 --> 01:13:54.223
But in the in his note, he says,
come join me, not for a new beginning,

dda7aaff-7813-47fa-8330-64e5fc327ab7-1
01:13:54.223 --> 01:13:56.360
but for a moment in time with an open
ending.

ff0211d3-e3d0-4966-9d53-e02d39e6c67f-0
01:13:56.600 --> 01:13:57.680
And that's really great.

58927458-cc23-4d7c-a8af-d8701376f6f3-0
01:13:57.920 --> 01:14:00.996
And what I would say is that's an
opportunity to feed that line back into

58927458-cc23-4d7c-a8af-d8701376f6f3-1
01:14:00.996 --> 01:14:04.240
their dialogue as if he's referencing
something they've already talked about.

9767024b-37b8-41c1-a38e-c95e71c36efa-0
01:14:04.240 --> 01:14:08.710
Because just in the previous scene,
it ends with her saying he holds my arm,

9767024b-37b8-41c1-a38e-c95e71c36efa-1
01:14:08.710 --> 01:14:10.800
letting me know he's ready for more.

7858faf2-97a1-4b1a-b7a4-0617f07f1cdb-0
01:14:11.240 --> 01:14:11.720
I'm not.

630a5045-bc12-4ac9-bd1d-3cbefd04eb0e-0
01:14:12.240 --> 01:14:15.680
And I think we could have used that line
about a new beginning there.

d84455fb-cec9-4167-b3b4-a10ffae4e869-0
01:14:16.080 --> 01:14:19.836
And so he's correcting that moment where
maybe he suggested a new beginning and

d84455fb-cec9-4167-b3b4-a10ffae4e869-1
01:14:19.836 --> 01:14:20.400
she reacted.

f1b628b8-3aa9-436f-af9c-2e07bd751539-0
01:14:20.800 --> 01:14:24.120
And this is the kind of moment that I
think does need to be dramatised right?

0621cbe7-e95a-46fb-8775-5d3f476a0575-0
01:14:24.120 --> 01:14:26.160
Where he holds my arm,
letting me know he's ready for more.

6e446456-4330-453c-99d2-d5f5489fd7d3-0
01:14:26.400 --> 01:14:27.080
I'm not.

c2561768-1170-4eb2-894a-a910d1f5c33e-0
01:14:27.520 --> 01:14:30.760
Show me how she's not like,
don't tell me I'm not, show me that.

cfe1a5fb-9f34-4c9f-9166-95377a3c5fa0-0
01:14:31.200 --> 01:14:33.800
Have him say something about a new
beginning.

49a6c6c2-5f85-45b0-bb05-76734e7c9b78-0
01:14:33.800 --> 01:14:35.600
Have her react negatively.

087777bd-d530-4509-8bea-b960d2dfa1e6-0
01:14:36.200 --> 01:14:39.720
That's a huge moment of conflict that
deserves to be played out.

9a0c4237-33a5-49fd-a17a-b0092b29e23a-0
01:14:40.160 --> 01:14:41.560
That would be satisfying.

f526b98e-5710-49e8-ad2a-2c9c43c5bb03-0
01:14:41.560 --> 01:14:44.160
You know, for Rita, like we're Oh no,
what's happened now?

5a5be305-b0da-4d19-9110-b45690ac1df8-0
01:14:44.160 --> 01:14:45.818
Like he,
we thought they were going to get

5a5be305-b0da-4d19-9110-b45690ac1df8-1
01:14:45.818 --> 01:14:48.711
together and now right near the end,
like it's all falling away because he

5a5be305-b0da-4d19-9110-b45690ac1df8-2
01:14:48.711 --> 01:14:50.639
said new beginning and she wasn't ready
for that.

d188bf81-8ebd-41d2-8331-2e635b2b0693-0
01:14:50.640 --> 01:14:53.280
Like that deserves all of that
dramatisation.

ec2f516f-706f-4409-bcf9-ba03919dbf52-0
01:14:53.640 --> 01:14:56.909
And then for him to in his note,
reference back to that and sort of be

ec2f516f-706f-4409-bcf9-ba03919dbf52-1
01:14:56.909 --> 01:15:00.133
like, not for a new beginning,
just for a moment in time with an open

ec2f516f-706f-4409-bcf9-ba03919dbf52-2
01:15:00.133 --> 01:15:02.160
ending that would land even harder,
I feel.

9af52241-61e5-4f95-87aa-e349e900c1dd-0
01:15:02.160 --> 01:15:06.185
So that's just an opportunity because I
do love that note and I love what it's

9af52241-61e5-4f95-87aa-e349e900c1dd-1
01:15:06.185 --> 01:15:06.440
says.

caa06f54-d933-41ba-88b1-9f6e4308ca6d-0
01:15:06.440 --> 01:15:09.141
It's just like,
let's weave it back in and make it land

caa06f54-d933-41ba-88b1-9f6e4308ca6d-1
01:15:09.141 --> 01:15:09.720
even harder.

ccd8d73e-8637-48e8-b392-b909f899780d-0
01:15:10.160 --> 01:15:13.880
Just as an overarching comment again,
back to the sexy stuff, right?

2c184ee4-04b7-4367-86dd-9315ce9289f3-0
01:15:13.880 --> 01:15:16.616
And I mean,
this would apply in a non sexy story as

2c184ee4-04b7-4367-86dd-9315ce9289f3-1
01:15:16.616 --> 01:15:16.880
well.

521ed9c8-854d-4bb7-80b6-bd11c37acd41-0
01:15:16.880 --> 01:15:20.898
But, and you've said this many times, Ed,
that things should be building towards a

521ed9c8-854d-4bb7-80b6-bd11c37acd41-1
01:15:20.898 --> 01:15:23.320
climax,
not sort of lingering in that same space.

dc580f24-7ea3-4acc-9244-ca20800e07e3-0
01:15:23.320 --> 01:15:26.793
And I do think there were moments where
we were sort of lingering maybe a little

dc580f24-7ea3-4acc-9244-ca20800e07e3-1
01:15:26.793 --> 01:15:28.680
too long in that same emotional
experience.

bd33a789-5890-4060-9d52-3c10dde12043-0
01:15:28.680 --> 01:15:31.574
And it would have been nice to sort of
build, build, build,

bd33a789-5890-4060-9d52-3c10dde12043-1
01:15:31.574 --> 01:15:35.482
have it all come crashing down in that
moment and then resolve it in the end and

bd33a789-5890-4060-9d52-3c10dde12043-2
01:15:35.482 --> 01:15:38.040
then come back harder for that climax
kind of thing.

d3412239-f840-44f9-9626-1b9efe94bb2f-0
01:15:38.400 --> 01:15:39.880
So that would be an opportunity as well.

0ce9051f-bf51-47f9-934f-4c5bb936d947-0
01:15:40.000 --> 01:15:40.320
Yeah.

889f51c1-c61e-4aa3-ba41-ca5b88461655-0
01:15:40.760 --> 01:15:44.060
Look, and I feel,
let's move on to the ending and talk

889f51c1-c61e-4aa3-ba41-ca5b88461655-1
01:15:44.060 --> 01:15:44.720
about that.

01074711-09b0-4518-b164-92817d81505c-0
01:15:44.720 --> 01:15:48.440
And we did speak a little bit about that
with Elise.

074541a0-1855-484d-9312-feaff5f838fd-0
01:15:49.000 --> 01:15:52.030
And I guess just on that point you made
about the climax,

074541a0-1855-484d-9312-feaff5f838fd-1
01:15:52.030 --> 01:15:55.322
I feel like a a part of this,
a big part of this is this whole

074541a0-1855-484d-9312-feaff5f838fd-2
01:15:55.322 --> 01:15:58.039
emotional state of mind that the
protagonist is in.

71d4ec63-23b5-4cc0-8d9e-5e0d9c335a6e-0
01:15:58.040 --> 01:16:02.660
And can she move beyond,
I guess her grief to the point where she

71d4ec63-23b5-4cc0-8d9e-5e0d9c335a6e-1
01:16:02.660 --> 01:16:04.200
can continue her life?

d93940b3-d89b-4aa9-ade0-3aa40e956e28-0
01:16:04.560 --> 01:16:09.233
And we have this other character that
comes into play and we spend a lot of

d93940b3-d89b-4aa9-ade0-3aa40e956e28-1
01:16:09.233 --> 01:16:11.693
time,
a lot of sexy time should be said

d93940b3-d89b-4aa9-ade0-3aa40e956e28-2
01:16:11.693 --> 01:16:12.800
lingering on that.

f1cc5da2-f0ad-46fb-817e-49fc0ae4f9dd-0
01:16:12.800 --> 01:16:17.520
And this whole will they won't they idea,
but we don't get the pay off.

fa3b30ac-8fd8-4775-811a-8ccc232561ca-0
01:16:17.600 --> 01:16:18.640
We don't get that climax.

bc727ed1-3cbf-47d5-aea5-8a538447cb9b-0
01:16:18.640 --> 01:16:19.880
We don't see them hook up.

6d018bcf-2f94-4708-8093-da894bdc9f08-0
01:16:20.360 --> 01:16:22.640
And that's a choice, right?

8a439c22-826b-44de-b247-5ff5ebb308ea-0
01:16:22.640 --> 01:16:26.280
And we do see her emotional pay off in
the end.

b3976c86-1631-427e-bb7c-3cf8f5225f91-0
01:16:26.280 --> 01:16:29.360
Like we see that she's been able to move
on in some way.

29b14a3e-8d2a-4abb-9381-b1550f24d766-0
01:16:29.960 --> 01:16:34.480
But we as readers of ****** fiction don't
get that sexual pay off.

9591ebe8-867d-4a75-b1a0-2f141f16c069-0
01:16:34.600 --> 01:16:34.840
Yeah.

d385dfe2-e802-442f-a178-a4f6d081e85f-0
01:16:34.840 --> 01:16:37.003
I mean,
there's sexual moments all through the

d385dfe2-e802-442f-a178-a4f6d081e85f-1
01:16:37.003 --> 01:16:37.280
story.

287d6f15-94d9-4a4c-bfef-cf77a94ed95f-0
01:16:37.280 --> 01:16:41.331
And it's like the earlier parts are,
are hotter than the than the climax

287d6f15-94d9-4a4c-bfef-cf77a94ed95f-1
01:16:41.331 --> 01:16:41.720
itself.

59f68b5e-11f1-4fdf-b70b-f2264e126280-0
01:16:42.120 --> 01:16:44.920
And I would have loved to have seen I'm,
I feel the same way.

5b4a01e7-b65c-472c-901c-86e46be9f48a-0
01:16:44.920 --> 01:16:46.960
Like I wanted more at that ending.

7fa85a0a-0c88-4d7d-adae-3dff9ff020a3-0
01:16:46.960 --> 01:16:48.720
I wanted it to lead to that moment.

d179a810-653b-4163-9c8b-75e2cf56ca11-0
01:16:48.720 --> 01:16:50.040
And it's, it's difficult.

d69acfbb-bd02-4b75-b35b-19b2a57fe7bc-0
01:16:50.040 --> 01:16:53.827
It is a question mark because, you know,
this story is really about the grief and

d69acfbb-bd02-4b75-b35b-19b2a57fe7bc-1
01:16:53.827 --> 01:16:54.520
the letting go.

335ea2b7-a3b5-45bb-bd93-9243762a7c6d-0
01:16:54.840 --> 01:16:57.400
And you don't want to lose that emotional
heart of this story.

12e923bc-6a7f-4f33-976c-743807923957-0
01:16:57.400 --> 01:16:58.880
And I don't think you need to lose it.

133ca360-3ff8-45b6-8de2-4b6e5d946dd7-0
01:16:59.240 --> 01:17:03.861
But I think that moment of letting go
needs to be much more wrapped up in the

133ca360-3ff8-45b6-8de2-4b6e5d946dd7-1
01:17:03.861 --> 01:17:08.542
sensory experience of the mind blowing
sex that they have after all this build

133ca360-3ff8-45b6-8de2-4b6e5d946dd7-2
01:17:08.542 --> 01:17:08.720
up.

ddfdaae9-1632-4158-a16f-111d1b299df6-0
01:17:09.240 --> 01:17:12.730
And it's interesting because, again,
in editing some of these stories,

ddfdaae9-1632-4158-a16f-111d1b299df6-1
01:17:12.730 --> 01:17:16.320
what I was often looking for,
we've got sex, but we didn't have emotion.

61657154-f8a4-4000-a031-fe4726c5a0d2-0
01:17:16.880 --> 01:17:19.815
And in this story,
we've got the emotion but not the sex

61657154-f8a4-4000-a031-fe4726c5a0d2-1
01:17:19.815 --> 01:17:21.000
right at the end there.

653980e3-5757-45a7-b5aa-8769b4f4e9ad-0
01:17:21.400 --> 01:17:22.440
And I think you need both.

d9b14bdf-9321-449e-b69a-5569448b70f3-0
01:17:22.760 --> 01:17:24.734
Yeah,
maybe maybe the way to think about it is

d9b14bdf-9321-449e-b69a-5569448b70f3-1
01:17:24.734 --> 01:17:27.254
that the story needs the payoff and the
sex needs a payoff,

d9b14bdf-9321-449e-b69a-5569448b70f3-2
01:17:27.254 --> 01:17:28.640
and they have to kind of line up.

f8032d83-646f-4830-aef5-17a832a9a651-0
01:17:28.760 --> 01:17:30.840
That's what I was finding in the stories.

63456197-f025-4c78-b769-d335489b4fb5-0
01:17:30.840 --> 01:17:35.171
It's like we need the character's
emotional arc, whatever that might be,

63456197-f025-4c78-b769-d335489b4fb5-1
01:17:35.171 --> 01:17:39.680
and we also need the arc of the story,
the sex, the plot, those two things.

b84ba573-8268-49b6-8c95-f1cc146d8a74-0
01:17:39.680 --> 01:17:42.526
Both need to climax at the same time,
you know,

b84ba573-8268-49b6-8c95-f1cc146d8a74-1
01:17:42.526 --> 01:17:44.840
for it to be as satisfying as possible.

86e25fba-1970-42f4-ad44-8386c9fd85ce-0
01:17:44.840 --> 01:17:46.680
Like, quite sincerely, I think.

79a22f8a-e70b-48a0-9d77-4eaa710776df-0
01:17:46.720 --> 01:17:50.132
I think you can have one or the other if
you want, but I think for a very,

79a22f8a-e70b-48a0-9d77-4eaa710776df-1
01:17:50.132 --> 01:17:52.680
very resonant piece of ****** fiction,
you've got both.

50bd3425-2693-4907-8b60-5b9d813d0899-0
01:17:52.680 --> 01:17:55.280
And it's not easy to climax at the same
time.

454ba1f6-c3df-4180-b686-3adda9411fdf-0
01:17:55.280 --> 01:17:55.640
Oh, really?

57c521cb-28b6-4e2f-8e87-52ca3382a661-0
01:17:56.000 --> 01:17:56.760
Is it a challenge?

9684b58a-8195-4d6c-a420-35200bed8964-0
01:17:56.760 --> 01:18:02.600
Is it, I mean, at the exact same time?

6f9034a2-29f0-4882-a0d3-3e9fc24b4f9c-0
01:18:02.600 --> 01:18:07.720
OK, I didn't say no comment anyway,
so just on that as well.

73fba450-822f-4900-91ff-884746ee9906-0
01:18:07.720 --> 01:18:11.834
And we did talk about this with Elise,
but that moment at the end of it all

73fba450-822f-4900-91ff-884746ee9906-1
01:18:11.834 --> 01:18:13.080
washing down the drain.

959ff6a7-8e48-49d6-904c-b3e3c3203f37-0
01:18:13.440 --> 01:18:15.880
And I will be editing the story with
Jenny.

f3a5a2b1-33ee-4819-b48f-85f85de07c41-0
01:18:15.880 --> 01:18:20.440
And I think that's something that I'd
like to look at is while I think it's

f3a5a2b1-33ee-4819-b48f-85f85de07c41-1
01:18:20.440 --> 01:18:24.520
powerful to have this big moment of it
all like changing like that,

f3a5a2b1-33ee-4819-b48f-85f85de07c41-2
01:18:24.520 --> 01:18:25.480
that bit I love.

13e54297-00d0-4bd1-82c7-9637ab649d83-0
01:18:25.480 --> 01:18:29.622
So we don't want to move remove that,
but I think it needs to just shift into

13e54297-00d0-4bd1-82c7-9637ab649d83-1
01:18:29.622 --> 01:18:31.640
something a little bit more different.

6d8954d0-f543-4942-8f97-4db64374a935-0
01:18:31.640 --> 01:18:35.160
Not like it's all washed away,
but that we've up somehow.

fa022c99-3540-4f3f-9c57-1569969069f8-0
01:18:35.160 --> 01:18:39.521
We're getting to a new place where a new
place of comfort with something that's

fa022c99-3540-4f3f-9c57-1569969069f8-1
01:18:39.521 --> 01:18:41.320
been uncomfortable for some time.

97e1d48d-2921-41b3-8a6e-3639b0d4bc42-0
01:18:41.320 --> 01:18:42.960
So yeah,
and I think that's all you can ask for

97e1d48d-2921-41b3-8a6e-3639b0d4bc42-1
01:18:42.960 --> 01:18:43.200
really.

848efa6d-c054-4666-a22c-83da105cce00-0
01:18:43.200 --> 01:18:46.100
When you say new place of comfort in that
final sentence,

848efa6d-c054-4666-a22c-83da105cce00-1
01:18:46.100 --> 01:18:47.600
it's letting go of everything.

be5fa4f8-283c-4c90-bcee-630ccaad9457-0
01:18:47.600 --> 01:18:48.800
It's neat little bow.

ddc28d0c-072a-4c80-9768-eef58eb07adc-0
01:18:49.280 --> 01:18:51.520
And I don't think you can really expect
that.

e4bf218c-8f3e-4d16-9c91-db1944c596ae-0
01:18:51.520 --> 01:18:55.253
I think it's more just like we've moved
to a new level, whatever that level is,

e4bf218c-8f3e-4d16-9c91-db1944c596ae-1
01:18:55.253 --> 01:18:57.120
and it can just be a tiny moment, right?

fe726c3c-028c-4918-ace9-5d4d1614ebc1-0
01:18:57.120 --> 01:18:58.880
Like just that tiny bit of relief.

05f5982f-37f2-44f8-a60d-e4592ba115a6-0
01:18:58.880 --> 01:19:02.400
She's been dealing with this back and
forth and like, am I ready?

165b35e6-5312-48c7-a275-46b37c67be70-0
01:19:02.400 --> 01:19:03.320
Am I not ready?

f09d45e3-3d2a-4727-a8a8-bedca508322c-0
01:19:03.840 --> 01:19:07.946
And it's just that moment of like, OK,
I think I'm ready to start thinking about

f09d45e3-3d2a-4727-a8a8-bedca508322c-1
01:19:07.946 --> 01:19:08.200
this.

70816498-1c4f-49f9-81f3-7e656346af7a-0
01:19:08.440 --> 01:19:12.263
But I think it's also an opportunity
because in a flash fiction story,

70816498-1c4f-49f9-81f3-7e656346af7a-1
01:19:12.263 --> 01:19:15.280
as you always say,
the like the Domino's knocking over.

d461e86c-86b3-4318-b968-032f63dec55a-0
01:19:15.640 --> 01:19:20.094
In a ****** fiction story,
you have like at your fingertips,

d461e86c-86b3-4318-b968-032f63dec55a-1
01:19:20.094 --> 01:19:23.891
so to speak,
pay the method that's pretty good that

d461e86c-86b3-4318-b968-032f63dec55a-2
01:19:23.891 --> 01:19:26.520
circled the rim, that one satisfied.

78b53568-1039-467d-a870-d8733bddcb21-0
01:19:27.720 --> 01:19:32.520
You have at your fingertips a ready made
method for making that happen.

74198f06-df93-4874-b946-839eb2528382-0
01:19:32.520 --> 01:19:34.680
It's the sex, like that's how it happens.

ed8e0ada-f7de-4a91-a017-50ee2f969586-0
01:19:35.080 --> 01:19:40.292
And if you can have that sex scene and
describe it and then the payoff comes as

ed8e0ada-f7de-4a91-a017-50ee2f969586-1
01:19:40.292 --> 01:19:41.400
a result of that.

573a5126-ef0f-49d2-89e6-1475ec4b1fe8-0
01:19:41.400 --> 01:19:42.960
Yeah, I think that's available to you.

abe98aa0-81d1-4c3c-a3ff-14f344db19d8-0
01:19:42.960 --> 01:19:43.360
Yeah.

36eb4c3c-13c7-46f7-87bf-292a58080b14-0
01:19:43.680 --> 01:19:47.564
And I think what's also great in this
story, and which Elise mentioned as well,

36eb4c3c-13c7-46f7-87bf-292a58080b14-1
01:19:47.564 --> 01:19:51.400
is that we also have this thought of her
now she's becoming the exhibitionist.

d5802a3b-d2b3-4d7b-becb-7d8959e97d92-0
01:19:51.400 --> 01:19:53.080
So that's happening at the same time too.

7b43deee-4cfc-4faf-b19e-c5a00ec0aede-0
01:19:53.080 --> 01:19:55.440
But that happens a little bit pre climax
here.

bd77b3bf-9b55-4ad2-aafa-617818733c72-0
01:19:55.440 --> 01:19:58.627
She's got her own sort of climax that
happens back there where she's being an

bd77b3bf-9b55-4ad2-aafa-617818733c72-1
01:19:58.627 --> 01:19:59.200
exhibitionist.

ffe587bd-ae56-449d-942f-f0c174e85536-0
01:19:59.200 --> 01:20:03.714
And then we have the moment with him and
I feel like they kind of need to happen

ffe587bd-ae56-449d-942f-f0c174e85536-1
01:20:03.714 --> 01:20:06.000
together to be as satisfying as possible.

0e300bc4-5346-47d8-8528-9707a09f9f3c-0
01:20:06.000 --> 01:20:10.784
That exhibitionism of her like really
letting go in every way kind of needs to

0e300bc4-5346-47d8-8528-9707a09f9f3c-1
01:20:10.784 --> 01:20:12.480
all happen at the same time.

44f91fa3-d080-4d3a-8d61-f65146d8f8be-0
01:20:12.480 --> 01:20:12.680
Yeah.

17981f55-0942-410f-b3f2-f66506316dc5-0
01:20:12.680 --> 01:20:16.400
Like maybe with her joining him in the
shower session thing.

51e04903-8af2-47c0-a77b-fdced56c8d46-0
01:20:16.400 --> 01:20:16.920
Yeah, I agree.

f981972b-1f49-4927-a3e6-b48ea74aa50d-0
01:20:16.920 --> 01:20:19.440
I agree with that because it's it's both
tied in together.

b0e27dbf-488d-41f1-9328-0d7e1ffa2de6-0
01:20:19.920 --> 01:20:22.456
But yeah, like,
I feel like what we've been dwelling in

b0e27dbf-488d-41f1-9328-0d7e1ffa2de6-1
01:20:22.456 --> 01:20:23.680
in this whole conversation.

da84a2fe-cffa-4e08-8e46-bb9b210ec4e7-0
01:20:23.800 --> 01:20:28.057
Is like the detail, like we're actually,
we've become invested in this character

da84a2fe-cffa-4e08-8e46-bb9b210ec4e7-1
01:20:28.057 --> 01:20:31.054
now and we are looking at the nuance and
the detail and,

da84a2fe-cffa-4e08-8e46-bb9b210ec4e7-2
01:20:31.054 --> 01:20:33.998
and how we opportunities and all of that
sort of stuff,

da84a2fe-cffa-4e08-8e46-bb9b210ec4e7-3
01:20:33.998 --> 01:20:37.519
which is the sign of a great story for us
to, to be that invested.

207eb496-a088-492e-931b-a6cef2de2dca-0
01:20:37.520 --> 01:20:38.840
And this was a great story.

d22f208b-85ea-4f0f-ba90-3a5f143637db-0
01:20:38.840 --> 01:20:40.680
As we said it, it got cut.

30fcb82c-6cdc-46ae-a573-c147f1dcf140-0
01:20:40.680 --> 01:20:45.711
It was so close to the long list and it
was really ******* cute as well as being

30fcb82c-6cdc-46ae-a573-c147f1dcf140-1
01:20:45.711 --> 01:20:45.960
hot.

0cc1f9bd-0330-4ea2-8127-8fb245b49bcd-0
01:20:45.960 --> 01:20:49.080
It was really cute these moments between
them and I loved it.

c571516e-32af-4319-b167-0cec69f72314-0
01:20:49.080 --> 01:20:50.680
I really loved this story a lot.

c0358383-9b62-40fb-bc08-d38aefec18ab-0
01:20:51.200 --> 01:20:53.640
And yeah, like,
I'm really excited to publish it.

0f621ad1-8daa-4bce-baf2-a854643da642-0
01:20:53.640 --> 01:20:55.160
I think it is a great story.

4f04ee36-45f7-4a66-ac8c-0149132b226f-0
01:20:55.640 --> 01:20:55.800
Yeah.

6efb8fa0-9fe7-4d9d-9530-4a1041b9c688-0
01:20:55.800 --> 01:20:59.905
I think it was great from the outset in
terms of the the premise and getting us

6efb8fa0-9fe7-4d9d-9530-4a1041b9c688-1
01:20:59.905 --> 01:21:00.880
into the character.

0b18f701-98cc-426c-81f1-0a295a4a8c35-0
01:21:00.880 --> 01:21:05.785
And I really love an ****** story that
also has a strong emotional core that's

0b18f701-98cc-426c-81f1-0a295a4a8c35-1
01:21:05.785 --> 01:21:07.400
not just like, let's ****.

7b243ff2-1c29-465d-982e-8e3d070cfa47-0
01:21:07.680 --> 01:21:09.400
Yeah, as much as I love that as well.

8a6eff3e-7b65-4c27-a3eb-8397540bfcc0-0
01:21:10.280 --> 01:21:13.851
I think of all the stories that we chose
for the long list and the podium and the

8a6eff3e-7b65-4c27-a3eb-8397540bfcc0-1
01:21:13.851 --> 01:21:14.200
winners.

4d530587-8ea8-410c-91c3-a9d18762aa33-0
01:21:14.480 --> 01:21:16.759
If you go back and listen to the winners
episode,

4d530587-8ea8-410c-91c3-a9d18762aa33-1
01:21:16.759 --> 01:21:20.132
you'll you'll see that all of those
stories had a really strong emotional

4d530587-8ea8-410c-91c3-a9d18762aa33-2
01:21:20.132 --> 01:21:20.360
core.

5c2422fe-e7aa-4812-a1d0-fe7f0fd6fd4e-0
01:21:20.360 --> 01:21:23.800
And what this one also had is some great
sex like it had.

7d7080d9-3661-45d8-92d8-f21b5d78f5ea-0
01:21:23.880 --> 01:21:26.400
I really enjoyed the sex scenes.

638c98d3-ee79-480d-818f-af185f92cd8e-0
01:21:26.400 --> 01:21:30.164
And I think what we miss and we both
expressed it is at the end,

638c98d3-ee79-480d-818f-af185f92cd8e-1
01:21:30.164 --> 01:21:34.681
we want to see kind of those things come
together and give us the climax that

638c98d3-ee79-480d-818f-af185f92cd8e-2
01:21:34.681 --> 01:21:35.840
we've been promised.

32230019-2f4d-4a84-8fe6-cd0d24a6fa8e-0
01:21:35.840 --> 01:21:36.320
So.

4a5e0ab2-2a59-4b57-a2d3-d47d8c60df66-0
01:21:36.680 --> 01:21:40.958
And speaking as a woman over 40, Jenny,
you mentioned that you want to normalise

4a5e0ab2-2a59-4b57-a2d3-d47d8c60df66-1
01:21:40.958 --> 01:21:42.120
sex for women over 40.

5ec69d09-4138-4628-b606-ede2347d6976-0
01:21:42.320 --> 01:21:44.600
I think this story did a great job of
that.

c6a74c8d-ee73-43ac-85cf-ced6810764be-0
01:21:44.720 --> 01:21:45.880
It was really hot.

9aab3657-1404-41d6-b800-859d913823dc-0
01:21:45.880 --> 01:21:49.122
And, you know,
no ones questioning at any moment whether

9aab3657-1404-41d6-b800-859d913823dc-1
01:21:49.122 --> 01:21:51.000
she belongs in this scene or not.

e71e04f7-dcd0-4f7f-a5cb-149e0bcd8ad5-0
01:21:51.000 --> 01:21:54.160
And I think it was a really beautiful
story in that sense.

6aa4e32a-439f-42bb-975e-85fc3bd14bb1-0
01:21:54.480 --> 01:21:57.200
And I'm a great fan of sex women over 40
as well.

4082c910-635e-4a92-92c5-155d4828650e-0
01:21:57.480 --> 01:22:01.560
So but thank you so much, Jenny,
for your story.

2457b31c-5804-472c-8963-64878386bebb-0
01:22:01.560 --> 01:22:04.200
And hopefully this has given you a little
bit of insight.

9bc0dd7c-e170-46e6-b9f5-2e84e3e62c10-0
01:22:04.200 --> 01:22:07.240
It's it was a lot of fun for us to read
and talking about it.

089a526a-64dd-43f7-9519-9ddb6e02e114-0
01:22:07.240 --> 01:22:12.055
This was a new experience for both of us
really talking about a a sexy story in

089a526a-64dd-43f7-9519-9ddb6e02e114-1
01:22:12.055 --> 01:22:13.320
this level of detail.

7786f3bc-47a8-466c-bfa3-7248c240bb49-0
01:22:13.320 --> 01:22:16.480
So hopefully you got something out of it
because we definitely did.

a1bd46ab-9dab-4786-b889-0fb63aee3063-0
01:22:17.080 --> 01:22:17.880
Oh, hi.

3263f112-b9e4-4a95-9a2c-803b7de8fc72-0
01:22:20.560 --> 01:22:25.197
And we always say with our daredevils
that it takes a lot of bravery and

3263f112-b9e4-4a95-9a2c-803b7de8fc72-1
01:22:25.197 --> 01:22:28.120
perhaps masochism to sign up for a
daredevil.

1881c20b-6070-4160-9618-ba9a86e48d6c-0
01:22:28.400 --> 01:22:32.000
And I feel like that is amplified about
100 times for a bare devil.

e44e13f2-1792-4ae5-a4fc-ea8d52a7da8f-0
01:22:32.000 --> 01:22:32.480
Because we're not.

b84b4bb9-fa5f-468e-b190-32765c6f5099-0
01:22:33.560 --> 01:22:39.328
We're not talking about only your merits
as a writer and your artistic merits,

b84b4bb9-fa5f-468e-b190-32765c6f5099-1
01:22:39.328 --> 01:22:42.760
but perhaps also some of your deepest
desires.

0e6a487b-ad83-4288-a932-3d5ade77f7be-0
01:22:42.760 --> 01:22:46.997
And I don't know if this is,
this is your deepest desires, Jenny,

0e6a487b-ad83-4288-a932-3d5ade77f7be-1
01:22:46.997 --> 01:22:47.640
we assume.

eb817dcf-da9d-49b2-8d14-59cb85fc3b5c-0
01:22:47.720 --> 01:22:48.760
But this is the thing, right?

7caee72a-5a39-4a5b-a7af-e7120581ff62-0
01:22:48.760 --> 01:22:52.139
You put yourself out there,
you'll make a connection with people out

7caee72a-5a39-4a5b-a7af-e7120581ff62-1
01:22:52.139 --> 01:22:55.909
there who will like you, you know,
And I think that when you put out a piece

7caee72a-5a39-4a5b-a7af-e7120581ff62-2
01:22:55.909 --> 01:22:58.799
of ****** fiction,
there will be readers for that who will

7caee72a-5a39-4a5b-a7af-e7120581ff62-3
01:22:58.799 --> 01:22:59.240
enjoy it.

bfb832f5-9fdf-4408-bbd6-0ccc371f4691-0
01:22:59.240 --> 01:23:00.480
I did enjoy this story.

e9d1861d-1f60-45c5-ba4f-923e9fdb3a8a-0
01:23:00.720 --> 01:23:01.840
I'm happy to say that.

28dc6379-22a9-48f8-b8b2-e77126ad7899-0
01:23:01.840 --> 01:23:02.960
So absolutely.

8c36c7e4-e568-45ab-ba9b-f8bd239440ec-0
01:23:03.120 --> 01:23:04.880
100 times braver.

4a7681f6-ec2f-474f-9d70-35ea785c52b0-0
01:23:04.880 --> 01:23:07.880
And and I'm glad you got your girlfriends
around you.

dec1a5a6-ce0d-4a18-82c0-275a01b377a3-0
01:23:07.880 --> 01:23:09.280
I hope they're all chasing you.

e8606ec7-6640-4215-a176-9d4a6e7db451-0
01:23:09.280 --> 01:23:12.040
This is absolutely,
absolutely a moment of celebration.

d71c8ff4-9699-4e3b-94db-36893a1c40d0-0
01:23:12.040 --> 01:23:15.892
So thanks again, Jenny,
and we hope that you're not left too

d71c8ff4-9699-4e3b-94db-36893a1c40d0-1
01:23:15.892 --> 01:23:19.240
fragile to **** after after this bare
devil beating.

e5f8eca5-3f95-43b5-94e2-c02ae369cb56-0
01:23:20.560 --> 01:23:23.853
But just before we go,
we've asked our resident Dom to come in

e5f8eca5-3f95-43b5-94e2-c02ae369cb56-1
01:23:23.853 --> 01:23:27.877
and give you a little bit of a verbal
spanking because we know really that's

e5f8eca5-3f95-43b5-94e2-c02ae369cb56-2
01:23:27.877 --> 01:23:29.080
what you came here for.

0fb94622-10b4-4785-9411-638d30e14560-0
01:23:29.080 --> 01:23:31.240
So take it away, Elise.

267b17a2-757a-4719-82f4-2f3da06f975d-0
01:23:38.240 --> 01:23:41.160
Jenny, you are a terrible tease.

71d40653-c524-4f0f-8c9e-7c4e7a2a094f-0
01:23:41.400 --> 01:23:42.480
Shame on you.

15e96b97-9f12-458b-91e7-c278688d2572-0
01:23:43.360 --> 01:23:48.200
When you give me a funny title,
I expect you to be silly and frivolous.

454c7e71-6839-432a-9dce-ab3d5ff5f111-0
01:23:48.760 --> 01:23:51.320
None of this moving, heartfelt art.

0e8b21a1-2d99-40cc-af2b-6fe82d6c4ed0-0
01:23:51.400 --> 01:23:54.640
Go stand in the corner until I decide how
to punish you.

212e4f9c-5b14-4912-8009-ce65defb5664-0
01:23:59.080 --> 01:24:02.534
So thank you, Elise,
and we hope you're OK after that little

212e4f9c-5b14-4912-8009-ce65defb5664-1
01:24:02.534 --> 01:24:03.440
spanking, Jenny.

222b8e5e-d61f-48f0-a75c-d1994bc97eb7-0
01:24:04.120 --> 01:24:08.320
But we'll be back next week with our
second Baredevil.

7d6eb0d8-2697-4f93-b170-cb6cc146e00a-0
01:24:09.080 --> 01:24:12.640
And until then, right on, right on.

047b506d-95ac-475a-9d09-1423281ec8b6-0
01:24:15.080 --> 01:24:18.440
We hope you enjoyed this special
Daredevil episode of Not Quite Right.

24a11126-7ac4-42e0-a03f-c479fa9c1d26-0
01:24:18.800 --> 01:24:22.610
If you have thoughts on the story,
follow us on social media and join the

24a11126-7ac4-42e0-a03f-c479fa9c1d26-1
01:24:22.610 --> 01:24:23.280
conversation.

ad08f5fe-dce4-4480-8e67-59ae42e78104-0
01:24:23.600 --> 01:24:27.395
And if you'd like to participate in the
next round of the competition,

ad08f5fe-dce4-4480-8e67-59ae42e78104-1
01:24:27.395 --> 01:24:29.640
head over to ourwebsite@notquiteright.com.

958a35f5-53f5-4e77-a454-5843345fcf7f-0
01:24:29.920 --> 01:24:38.920
That's WRITE something doesn't seem quite
right.

51117ac1-35ad-4396-863a-9f3b23a28f45-0
01:24:43.120 --> 01:24:44.080
What does it smell like?

d3855fc3-fe6b-4979-8167-a5d854442d50-0
01:24:44.080 --> 01:24:45.200
What does it sound like?

b7a410e9-696d-410e-a0df-d99f6a573e6d-0
01:24:45.640 --> 01:24:46.880
You know, what does it taste like?

5a40a2ba-bb10-428e-86f3-e0131d678c4c-0
01:24:46.880 --> 01:24:51.315
Like what are what are all the senses
that are happening in this moment like

5a40a2ba-bb10-428e-86f3-e0131d678c4c-1
01:24:51.315 --> 01:24:54.137
not all at once when we don't want to
overdo it,

5a40a2ba-bb10-428e-86f3-e0131d678c4c-2
01:24:54.137 --> 01:24:58.400
but what is 1 specific little tiny detail
that encapsulates that feeling?

2fc28624-1df1-4cb6-b47e-4e5f2e191a58-0
01:24:58.400 --> 01:25:01.080
And I think that's the kind of thing to
strive for.

9687848b-1bc0-4b9e-8558-f16b3955ec3d-0
01:25:03.560 --> 01:25:04.160
Anyway.

21850e91-d824-4913-b9ea-3c6e1b3bd890-0
01:25:04.320 --> 01:25:04.760
Sounds good.

54a03a99-d4d9-49d6-811f-34e9052e99e5-0
01:25:06.720 --> 01:25:14.320
Like deliver that package if you want,
you can go straight to the **** my ****.

4497f3db-996a-4472-b0bf-67ddddcf50d6-0
01:25:19.600 --> 01:25:20.600
Missed help?